[Advaita-l] Creation & Creator
Bhaskar YR via Advaita-l
advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org
Tue Jun 24 05:37:58 CDT 2014
praNAms Sri Chandramouli prabhuji
I don’t know why your mails are directly coming to me instead of advaita-L group. And even when I hit the reply button it is going to the E-mail ID of the sender instead of group address. Kindly let me know whether I have to make any change in settings??
Now, coming back to the topic :
Jnani is a term we , the ajnanis , are using to identify the BMI complex remaining.
Ø You mean to say here prabhuji, we the ajnAni-s using the term ‘jnAni’ to the inert BMI to identify the jnAni prabhuji?? There is no jnAni concept as such after the dawn of jnAna and socalled jnAni is no more individual jnAni but it is only ajnAni-s identifying the BMI complex as jnAni!!?? Can we extend this to socalled jnAni’s upadesha also prabhuji?? Some years back Sri Atmachaitanya prabhuji has brought up this issue and there he argued that there can be ONLY ONE jnAni and plural jnAni-s is not tenable in advaita. OK prabhuji I agree. But now tell me what is that that is left the BMI complex (after jnAni’s shareera tyAga) to call us it is only ‘pArthiva shareera’ of the jnAni?? What difference we see between living jnAni and dead jnAni to say like this?? Ples. Clarify.
Unlike the jiva which used to identify itself with that BMI complex earlier, now there is no entity like jnani to identify itself with the BMI complex.
Ø Then jnAni seeing the ajnAni, teaching by jnAni to the ajnAni ( like Krishna teaching geeta to Arjuna, shankara writing bhAshya to his followers etc. etc.) etc. are all in the perception of ajnAni only, since there is no jnAni chaitanya per se and what remains is only BMI. Shankara takes a different position than yours prabhuji. He says jnAni even get nidra & svapna also but he would have nishchaya jnAna that he is avasthAteeta. In bruhadbhAshya there is a mention about it prabhuji.
What remains is only the BMI complex ( sthula/sukshma/karana sharira ) .
Ø Very interesting…kindly let me know where shankara says that after the Atmaikatva jnAna what remains is only BMI without any chaitanya component in it??
This complex continues to function as a conscious entity driven by the prarabdha karma/vasanas/mental disposition as per the prior training of the sadhaka.
Ø Here is the crux of the issue. You say prior training of the sAdhaka (which is ofcourse sAdhaka chaitanya using his BMI, hope you are with me here) the post jnAna period of sAdhaka (who is now secondless Atman) the complex continues to function as a conscious entity !!?? ( jada on its own function like chaitanya??) driven by prArabdha karma…Here again the question remains intact, whose prArabdha it is?? jadAntaHkaraNa on its own cannot accrue any karma phala without any ‘driving force’ behind it. And NOW, that driving force has no more personal identity as such but surprisingly despite in absence of this driving force that same sAdhaka’s BMI starting on its own as conscious entity driven by erstwhile sAdhaka, who is noway connected to present BMI complex!! is this iwhat you are explaining with regard to jnAni’s BMI during post jnAna period prabhuji??
In your first alternative you are assuming that bhautika sharira cannot survive without an owner ( jnani or ajnani ).
Ø Yes, bhautika shareera cannot survive on its own without the presence of kshetrajna or vijnAnAtma…As we know what happens to the bhautika shareera when there is no chaitanya in it…we call it ‘shava’ ( a dead body) and without this chaitanya this bhautika shareera is subject to decomposition…this is pratyaksha gOchara is it not??
Why should it be so ? It does survive till exhaustion of prarabdha.
Ø IMO, to exhaust this prArabdha, some operative force should be their behind this BMI complex, it cannot act on its own (since it is jada) without the aid of driving force i.e. chaitanya. And my doubt is which is that chaitanya that is going to be there in that particular BMI to experience the phala of prArabdha karma??
Hope I made my doubts clear to you.
Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!
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