World-view as dream (fwd)

Jaldhar H. Vyas jaldhar at BRAINCELLS.COM
Tue Dec 10 21:11:21 CST 2002

It looks like I owe Jagannath a big apology.  It seems he was also
affected by the bouncing mail problem but I told him his messages had gone
through to the list.  In fact they had not.  So here are they are now.  If
anyone else is also have trouble posting to the list, please send it to me
personally (with full headers) and I will repost it.

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Jagannath Chatterjee <jagchat01 at>

Dear Friends,

--- Bhadraiah Mallampalli <vaidix at HOTMAIL.COM> wrote:
> Sri Chandrasekaran,
> >For eg. mirage appears as water and deludes its
> viewer because of the
> > >material knowledge - "if there is water, there
> will be reflection".
> There is a little wrinkle here w.r.t "material
> knowledge" that we have about
> the waking state. Material knowledge is no doubt the
> first evidence we have
> about this world. It is also the most irrefutable
> evidence we have about the
> waking state, inspite of advaita. Refuting this
> evidence will not work
> because it will react like cat in a closed room
> (maarjaala nyaayam).

I agree with you to a certain extent here. But I feel
we can still refute this evidence when we reflect on
the basic concept of advaita, i.e. the one indivisible
self. When we see magic on stage we put our disbelief
on hold and tend to believe the magic. But when we see
the same magic again but with the knowledge that it is
indeed a sleight of hand, we are more aware of its
unreality. Advaita teaches us to do this.

> The problem with the material knowledge is that we
> are forced to have it. It
> is not something we acquired due to our choice. We
> are forced to be born on
> this earth, forced to grow up, forced to learn about
> the waking state,
> forced to eat and so on. The sense of choice has
> long been taken away and we
> are dumped in this waking state, by you know who,
> the prajna, the deep sleep
> state, the saguNa brahman.

We are forced to have the material knowledge only to
the extent of our prarabdha (actions in our previous
life). Therefore nothing is forced upon us. It is just
the fructification of our own karma. We can have some
respite from this sense of helplessness when we
surrender ourselves to God or the nirguna Brahman. The
same saguna Brahman will then act as our ally and give
us some control over our lives. It is like crossing
the waves of the ocean and going out to the deep sea.
The water is calmer there.

> Whatever material knowledge that we have about water
> causing reflection is
> just another piece of crumbs thrown at us by the
> saguNa brahman. The real
> knowledge is still with saguNa brahman, far from our
> reach.

It is not far from our reach. That is the delusion
most of us are subject to. In fact it is the
substratum of our life, the closest ally we have. If
we let go of our hopes, aspirations, expectations and
sit down to meditate on the nirguna Brahman, we can
sense our closeness with it. At first, like we all
experience, it appears as a blank void. But there are
people who experience a joy in such meditation and
derive energy from it. They actually come into touch
with this nirguna Brahman.


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