New member introduction: Ganga Karmokar

sharon tang crystalkundalini at HOTMAIL.COM
Mon Oct 2 23:19:24 CDT 2000

Namaste and Good Morning -
There is no past tense... nor is there a future or a present... Realization
is the Truth of Being... it is beyond time and the divisions of Maya... Maya
is empty and therefore also non-dual in nature... and in the emptiness what
remains? Only Source...
Emptiness contains All yet holds nothing.... Personality disolves.. it
ceases that which you write to is a cog in the universe.. but Self is
here are a couple of writings that may explain....
If you think that this line is for my continuation of the path you are wrong
the path is ended... No matter the vehicle... whether Advaita or  Zen or
Christianity that which is called realization is the same experience and
Truth... Beyond All Dogma and division... undiluted Pristine Awareness...

This is a letter written to an intellectual that disputes Advaita:

This was in regards to your continuing conversation on Advaita with
Vinaire.... While Krishnamurti is wonderful, still unless you know beyond a
shadow of a doubt through direct experience, then it only becomes a futile
intellectual battle built on hearsay.. and what you think may "perhaps" be
true.... What Vinaire has spoken of and what i speak of is what is KNOWN
from direct knowledge... and it only comes when you go beyond mind and
thought.. for any thought or word brings concepts and form into being... and
then you are separate into the world of maya.... This is why it is
impossible to explain fully... for any word that i would try to use sets up
limitations and boundaries, and concepts.... even if i say formless it only
brings to mind a state or quality of form....
while intellect can discard one thing at a time as transient and therefore
not the Constant or Source... it cannot take you to the ultimate truth of
existance beyond existance or the maya realm of which it has proceeded
from.... but perhaps you do not wish to hear this from me now and that is
fine too... you are entitled to your view of truth -or your illusion of
truth whatever it is....
The Emptiness which holds the All is not a void of flatness but pregnant
with all that is or will be.... It is the potential for that which is
expressed in form....

all i can say is that in going beyond mind and thought in the silence you
will find that all your thought to be true drops in an instant... and you
KNOW that the maya realm is only a more extended dream state... it no longer
has the hold on you... the illusions are dropped... and That Which Is or
Source is All that remains... It is the Constant and permeates all but is
untouched by any of the proceedings in the maya realm of the transient....
And the Essence of your Being is only that Source... Beyond a shadow of a
doubt you have never been born nor never died the essense of you IS...
Eternal.... all that happens, happens only to form and to your mental
illusions that you are only the body in this existance.... but to the real
you that is ever eternal -- Nothing can touch or harm nor change its eternal
nature... which is Bliss, and the Emptiness that is Complete containing All
in potentiality... no longer personality... but it is more real than
anything which you now view in the maya realm.... and this is realization
... simply to come to that place... where there is no within or without...
it simply IS... and there are no longer any questions... nor any disputes...
nor any conviction( for in conviction there must be doubt somewhere, and
there is NO Doubt) ... the path ends.... and liberation is won... for you
find there has never been anything to be liberated from.... and you see the
maya realm for what it is... a playground of mind and desire... the ever
transient world in change... the only constant is change... And you see the
emptiness in it and know it is non-dual in nature also..... and you rest in
the Silence beyond "rational" mind and thought... no thoughts floating in
endless succession.... and if any arise they are only empty clouds that pass
without any substance....
when the thoughts end - and even the desire for liberation and enlightenment
has been dropped. then and only then does the shift take place... and All
changes in a split second... The world is not and only the Substance... the
Essense.... the Truth beyond Division remains.... you are no longer
witness.. for there must be subject and object to be witnessed.... you are
not a witness of anything.... yet you are.... Complete and Whole with more
Life and Bliss than you can ever obtain in the transient fleeting world of
maya.... Simply you are... and yet you are not... for there is no person...
no body.... no mind... no thought... no personality.... Yet you are Real and
the Eternal Nature that gives life... sustains life... and is life....

Why all this came out now to you is a mystery to me.... but it did... and it
stands for whatever reason.....

Love and Blessings
Excerpt of letter: this may help you to know what i am about....

Now without further delay let me start with your
questions one by one....

Q:  How can one go beyond Thought?

A:it is possible... it is like a shift... your mind is
absolutely still.... silent.. no thought.... no
judging.... no emotion.... stillness.... you can get
there by starting to be mindful of what you are
doing.... do One thing at a time.... no thinking of a
million other things that must be done.... focus on
one thing.... like the japanese tea ceremony.. each
action is deliberate... absolute focus.... this is how
you begin.... and you simplify your life...

Q: Aren't you yourself existing only as long as you
think ?

A:The "ego" self exists only as long as there is
thought... yes that is true.... but that which gives
you life -- the source--- exists always.. and you may
only come to discover That when thought stops.. and
ideations stop... and conditons and conditionings are
dropped and transcended.... i dislike the term "Self"
as it seems to denote ego... but what you are is not
found in the personality and the form... you are
beyond... in Self there is no personality... nor
form.... only light... emptiness pregnant with all....
absolute wholeness.... it is difficult to explain with
words of limitation for what is beyond this maya
realms experience....
here is my writing of the experience beyond mind and experience...

I AM the eternal emptiness of Being:
One without a second....
The Life of All Life
The Death of All Death.
The unborn ever Effulgent One...
Being beyond Eternal
That Which Is and Is not; for past, present, and future
have no meaning within the Emptiness of Now..
For only Now exists in the void of Permanance...
Yet how can permanance be stated
when impermanance does not exist...
Note: Do not think by reading these words that you will understand
"That" which "Is" for all words and concepts are born of the world of
duality... Truth of Being is beyond mind, and duality, and division...
therefore unexpressable within the confines of limiting language and

Q:To go beyond words would be like sleeping

A:.In a way you can say that it is sleeping... but it
is a conscious sleeping... you are absolutely
aware.... Pure Awareness...

Q: As long as there is a feeling of existence, then
thought has to be. That is why, I favor the Upanishad
and people who say it can never be known or

A:It is not existance in the sense that you mean the
word... it is Absolute Existance.... beyond the
limited existance.... this sound like double talk but
it is not.... it has more Reality than the maya
realm.... but it has no form... you cannot get there
by thought.... you must drop all thought and in the
silence it emerges in its Pristine Clarity....
It can be known and experienced.... but you cannot
explain it... it is impossible with language to
verbilize Source.... Yes the Upanishads have tried to
explain the unexplainable but eventually you must
throw up your hands in defeat.... you KNOW but cannot
speak so that anyone else can understand... for it
cannot be "understood" by intellectual means....

Q:Knowledge comes out of memory. For something to
become part of the memory is only possible through
thought and experience, which goes against the
"...beyond mind and thought.".

A: You are talking about logical conditionings... and
how you learn so-called intellectual knowledge... i am
talking about direct knowledge... NOT memory... you do
not remember... you go into the NOW... it always
exists.... and you once again cannot get there by the
process of logic... logic can only be used to negate
what is not... but it cannot show you what is.... you
can eliminate whatever is transient in nature until
you get to the end of the line... then you hit the
wall... when you hit the wall then you must surrender
all..( writing # 63 the wall).. even the wanting to
reach realization.... then in the silence you
transcend all the barriers.... and true KNOWLEDGE not
that which is taught... but that which is the truth of
Existance comes to the forefront.... believe me you
cannot miss it.... this is why realization is the
great cosmic joke so to speak.... you search
everywhere for God and Truth... and in the end you
find you could not have gotten away from it if you
tried... it is impossible... as that is the ultimate
reality... if all maya ends.... Source - Truth - That
Which Is- remains.... and you are one with this
truth.... (read In the Moment of Now #29)

Continued dialog Me is the questioner and You is what i wrote that is being
commented on and answer is my further comments and clarifications....

Continued Answers to Dialog

You : It is the Constant and permeates all but is untouched by any of the
proceedings in the maya realm of the transient....

Me : Aren't you still dividing the "it" from "Maya" ?  Isn't it Maya as long
as there is division?

A: There is in truth no division... division is created by mind and thought
i am this ego form alone... once that drops then the maya realm becomes
empty in nature and thereby non-dual.... Maya rests within the Constant but
the Constant is not touched my maya....

You : Nothing can touch or harm nor change its eternal nature... which is
Bliss, and the Emptiness that is Complete containing All in potentiality...

Me : Bliss makes sense when compared to it's opposite, or a neutral state
where there is no bliss nor it's opposite. So isn't it Maya again, as long
as there is bliss ?

A: No the Bliss or Anand is not the bliss of maya happiness which comes and
goes... it is the permanant reality beyond states of mind....

You :and liberation is won... for you find there has never been anything to
be liberated from.... and you see the maya realm for what it is... a
playground of mind and desire...

Me : As long as you see anything, there is division. Isn't that still part
of Maya ?

A: It is not that you are seeing anything at that point... you are not
seeing.... you are aware.... Pure Awareness of the Reality... it is beyond
the 5 senses... But clearly it IS... ABSOLUTE... with more reality than the
maya which is ever in flux....

You : Simply you are... and yet you are not... for there is no person... no
body.... no mind... no thought... no personality

Me : Again, no thought is no existence, which is like sleep. No thought is
something that can never be experienced or felt and so can never be captured
by memory. And so cannot be spoken about.

A: Since you haven't experienced it yourself you say it doesn't exist... but
i assure you it does... and you can experience what is beyond thought and
mind in the Silence.... Be STILL and KNOW... that is all BE STILL and
KNOW.... it is beyond mind and memory... it is the ETERNAL NOW.... past,
present, and future, have no meaning ... it is the eternal beyond time and

The mind is capable of creating several illusions. What we desire, will be
created by the mind and states of stillness and emtiness are easily acheived
by meditation. And to experience anything, there has to be a division, even
to experience emtiness or something else that is "neither fullness nor
emptiness". As long as it is an experience, then it is just the mind. The
Krishna worshippers will only get visions of Krishna and not Jesus or
Buddha. The devout Christian will get a vision of jesus. It is the mind
acting on the images in our memory and our goals.

We will see what we want to see, and experience what we want to experience.
After reading all the books, lsitening to all the Gurus, and following some
path,the mind will create images of the goal that we have been pursuing.
Since we invest lots of time and effort and are yearning to reach the goal,
we thing that we got it and feel very happy. While actually we are kidding

Sleep being a divisionless state (no experiencer) can never become part of
our memory. No one can ever describe the state of sleep. Similary if there
is a state of Samadhi as the books claim, it can never become part of our
memory. No one can say that 'I am in Samadhi'. If one is in a position to
say that, then it was just a state created by the mind and is just another

A: You can be Aware of the Sleeping State... it is possible... it is just
that you have not reached that point... And yes the mind will create any
image or illusion of truth... this is why it is stressed NOT to read to much
of others experiences... But "realization" is not in this catagory... to
reach it you must go beyond and drop all of the conditionings and
pre-conceived notions... All must be surrendered... even the desire to reach
.... and when realization comes... it is
are not experiencing you ARE.... not personality - not witness - only SOURCE
  -- that is all that remains... SOURCE BEYOND ILLUSIONS AND DIVISION....

LOVE AND BLESSINGS   hope this answers some of your questions... please feel
free to e-mail anytime.... g.

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bhava shankara deshikame sharaNam

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