[Advaita-l] [advaitin] 'Satyasya Satyam..' of the Upanishad explained in the Bhagavatam

[Michael Chandra Cohen]

Namas,te Raghav ji,

// Michael ji is jumping to paramārtha without recognising the pedagogical
need of the many student/aspirants which needs sattā-dvaividhyaṁ involving
the use of the word mithyā.//
-- You bring up a good point. Lokya drshti is the empirical view of life
most of us accept without question. The few who turn to sruti come to learn
about mithya, avidya, Brahman etc. from a sastrika view of reality. These
are not diverse orders of reality but simply different views of existence.
Sastrika view is purposely superimposed for the sake of teaching. It is not
intending us to actually classify three orders of reality.
-- Consider, for instance, Sankara's Bhasya on Karika 2.31, there is no
third order of reality expressed. The world is as illusory as a dream which
is taught to us by the sacred texts:
The unreality of duality has been demonstrated by Vedānta Scriptures.
Therefore it is stated:—Dream objects and illusion, though unreal when
their true nature is considered, are thought, in spite of their unreality,
as real by the ignorant. As an imaginary city in the sky, filled with shops
full of vendable articles, houses, palaces and villages frequented by men
and women, though appearing real to us, is seen to vanish suddenly as dream
and illusion, which are known to be unreal (though they appear to be
real),—so also is perceived this entire duality of the universe to be
unreal. Where is this taught? This is thus taught in the Vedānta
Scriptures. 🙏🙏🙏


On Wed, Sep 24, 2025 at 8:47 PM Raghav Kumar Dwivedula via Advaita-l <
advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:

> Namaste Subbu ji
> Thank you for re-sharing your article clarity establishing that both Sri
> Shankara and Sri Sureshvaracharya accept that the use of words like
> āpekṣika satyam and pāramārthika satyam.
>
> Also can you please quote the verse where it is shown that for the ajñānī
> the Jagat is real while for the student/aspirant of Advaita, the world is
> mithyā, while for the jñānī, the world is *asat*.
>
> The law of excluded middle applies to the first and last categories.
> Michael ji is jumping to paramārtha without recognising the pedagogical
> need of the many student/aspirants which needs sattā-dvaividhyaṁ involving
> the use of the word mithyā.
>
> Also the question can be posed, for whom is the idea of satyam-mithyā
> taught? The jñānī does not need the word or category of mithyā. The ajñānī
> who does not care for mokṣa regards the jagat as satyaṁ.
>
> Blindly applying the putative “law” of the excluded middle makes no sense
> in this context.
>
>
> Om
> Raghav
>
> On Wed, 24 Sep 2025 at 11:08 PM, V Subrahmanian via Advaita-l <
> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
>
> > Dear Michael ji,
> >
> > Shankara and Sureshwara have accepted three levels of Reality in the
> > Taittiriyopanishad.  Here is the blog detailing that:
> >
> >
> https://adbhutam.wordpress.com/2010/02/17/paramarthika-vyavaharika-satyam/
> >
> > warm regards
> > subbu
> >
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Sep 24, 2025 at 5:36 PM Michael Chandra Cohen <
> > michaelchandra108 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Namaste Subbuji,
> > >
> > > "Relative reality" is misleading and oxymoronic. Reality cannot be
> > partial
> > > or not real - the law of excluded middle - either something exists or
> > does
> > > not exist. Snake is not a relative reality - it is rope misperceived.
> > The
> > > fear of snake is a reaction to the misperception of rope but not a
> > reaction
> > > caused by the 'relative reality' of an imagined snake. To impose
> reality
> > > upon error or misperception whether 'borrowed' or 'relative' or
> > 'temporary'
> > > etc. is a misguided teaching.  In that way we need to view vyavaharika.
> > It
> > > is only a perception taken to be real.
> > > ,
> > > Here are 5 pages of citations from SSSS's The Method of the Vedanta/MOV
> > > and elsewhere that correct this misunderstanding of Bhasya.
> > >
> > > On Wed, Sep 24, 2025 at 2:22 AM V Subrahmanian <
> v.subrahmanian at gmail.com
> > >
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > >> In the Brihadaranyaka Upanishad 2.3.6 is the famous mantra, a part of
> > >> which reads:
> > >>
> > >> अथात आदेशो नेति नेति न ह्येतस्मादिति नेत्यन्यत्परमस्त्यथ नामधेयं
> सत्यस्य
> > >> सत्यमिति प्राणा वै सत्यं तेषामेष सत्यम् ॥ ६ ॥
> > >>
> > >>  Now therefore the description (of Brahman): 'Not this, not this.'
> > >> Because there is no other and more appropriate description than this
> > 'Not
> > >> this.' Now Its name: "The Truth of truth.' The vital force is truth,
> > and It
> > >> is the Truth of that.
> > >>
> > >> The gist of the mantra is: the term 'prāṇā:' signifies the entire
> > >> creation, both at the individual level and the cosmic level. At the
> > >> individual level we have the subtle body, the sense organs, that
> > illumine
> > >> the creation outside the body. The world outside, being insentient,
> get
> > >> illumined by the subtle body/organs. This two-fold categorization can
> be
> > >> compared to the 'kṣetram' (field) of the 13th chapter of the Bh.Gita.
> > There
> > >> too in the 5th and the 6th verses the entire kṣetram is presented as
> > >> consisting of the subtle body of the individual and the outside world.
> > This
> > >> is termed 'satyam', in its primary sense, vācyārtha. And the 'satyam'
> of
> > >> that ('prāṇā:' - kṣetram) is Brahman, the absolute Satyam.
> > >>
> > >> From the above study of the mantra, we derive the meaning: the first
> > >> 'satyam' (satyasya) is the created world. This has only a
> > >> dependent/relative reality. It derives its reality from Brahman, the
> > >> Absolute Satyam.
> > >>
> > >> It is interesting to note that we have a verse in the Bhagavatam that
> > >> brings out the above two levels of reality:
> > >>
> > >> आत्मानमेव आत्मतया अविजानतां
> > >>
> > >> तेनैव जातं निखिलं प्रपञ्चितम् ।
> > >>
> > >> ज्ञानेन भूयोऽपि च तत्प्रलीयते
> > >>
> > >> रज्ज्वां अहेर्भोगभवाभवौ यथा ।। 10.14.25
> > >>
> > >> A person who mistakes a rope for a snake becomes fearful, but he then
> > >> gives up his fear upon realizing that the so-called snake does not
> > exist.
> > >>
> > >> Similarly, for those who fail to recognize You, Brahman, as the
> Supreme
> > >> Soul of all
> > >> souls, the *expansive illusory material existence arises,* but
> knowledge
> > >> (realization) of You (Your True Nature) at once causes it  (the
> > variegated
> > >> world of plurality) to subside.
> > >>
> > >> In the above verse we see the expression of relative reality, the
> world,
> > >> and the Absolute Reality, Brahman. This is exactly the teaching of the
> > >> Upanishad through the pithy statement: satyasya satyam.  The rope is
> the
> > >> Satyam and the snake is the satyam, in the analogy of the Bhagavatam.
> > There
> > >> itself, the relatively real, the world, is contrasted with the
> > Absolutely
> > >> Real, Brahman. The state of ignorance is signified by the world and
> the
> > >> state of realization is conveyed by the term Brahman. One can recall
> the
> > >> verse 2.69:
> > >>
> > >> या निशा सर्वभूतानां तस्यां जागर्ति संयमी ।
> > >>
> > >> यस्यां जाग्रति भूतानि सा निशा पश्यतो मुनेः ॥ ६९ ॥
> > >>
> > >> 2.69 The self-restrained man keeps awake during that which is night
> for
> > >> all creatures. That during which creatures keep awake, it is night to
> > the
> > >> seeing sage.
> > >>
> > >> Here the waking and sleep are symbolic of real and unreal: For the
> > Jnani,
> > >> the waking means the Absolute Truth. For the ajnanis waking is to the
> > >> relative world.
> > >>
> > >> The relatively real has no reality of its own and hence is only
> > >> dependently real, paratantra satyam. On the other hand, Brahman, the
> > >> Absolute Reality, does not need to acquire reality from any other
> > source.
> > >> The world needs reality from Brahman. All this is implied by the
> > >> Upanishadic statement: satyasya satyam.
> > >>
> > >> Why does the Upanishad call the vyavaharika, the world, 'satyam'?  The
> > >> Upanishad is alluding to, doing anuvāda of, the uninformed person
> > holding
> > >> the world to be real, untaught.  This has to be corrected. Hence the
> > >> Upanishad *as though* holds the world to be satyam and goes on to
> teach,
> > >> in the manner of 'from the known to the unknown', and the
> > adhyāropa-apavāda
> > >> nyāya, the truth that Brahman is indeed the absolute Satyam.
> > >>
> > >> There are many such verses in the Bhagavatam that carry the
> Upanishadic
> > >> purport.
> > >>
> > >> Om Tat Sat
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
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