[Advaita-l] Narada Purana - Returning to earth even after attaining the Vaishnava-Parama pada

[V Subrahmanian]

On Mon, Aug 11, 2025 at 11:33 PM Sangeerth P <psangeerthgenius at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Namaste sir
>
> 1. The Mahalakshmi ashtotram acceptability in what sense I am not able to
> understand sir. Also it was just an example that I wanted to tell.
>

Since the Ashtottaram says  *Brahma-Vishnu-Shiva-Atmikayai Namaha*,
Mahalakshmi will have to be the antaryami of Vishnu too. Is this acceptable
to Srivaishnavas?  For the Atharvashikha mantra 'Brahma Vishnu Rudra Indra
- all are born of Shambhu', Ramanuja in his Vedarthasangraha says: while
Brahma, Rudra, etc. are born of their karma, Vishnu here is avatara.
Shambhu here is Narayana.  So says Ramanuja.

Also what is meant by kārana vaikuntha? Is this vaikuntha the cause - for
what?

regards
subbu



> 2. As I have told its an Arthapaththi pramana. You infer at which place
> Vishnu refers to the one in Karya Vaikunta and at which place Vishnu refers
> to Nitya Vibhuti Vaikuntam. Its purely inferential and will come through
> the lineage. Because the same place (Vaikunta) cant be told be
> un-returnable as well as returnable. It would be a contradictory. And hence
> this has to be taken through Arthapathi pramanam.
> 3. As told in the above point in Katha Upanishad one refers to the Vishnu
> in Sri Vaikuntam(Nitya vibhuti). Narada purana would refer to Karya
> Vaikuntam.
> Regards
> Sangeerth P
> 8608658009
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 11, 2025 at 11:04 PM V Subrahmanian <v.subrahmanian at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Aug 11, 2025 at 9:25 PM Sangeerth P via Advaita-l <
>> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
>>
>>> In Vishishtadvaita philosophy, we make a clear distinction between
>>> *Vishnu*
>>> and *Narayana* in certain contexts. For example, in the *Mahalakshmi
>>> Ashtothram*, one of Mahalakshmi’s names is *Brahma-Vishnu-Shiva-Atmikayai
>>> Namaha*. If Narayana is the *Aadhara* (support) of everything, and if
>>> Vishnu and Narayana were entirely identical in all aspects, then how
>>> could
>>> Mahalakshmi be described as the *Atma* (inner self) of Vishnu?
>>>
>>
>> Namaste
>>
>> Is this *Mahalakshmi Ashtothram* acceptable to Srivaishnavas? Also, is
>> the two-type Vaikuntha that Ramanuja system accepts, admitted in any Purana
>> like the Bhagavatam?  There we see the Jaya-Vijaya episode happening in
>> 'Vaikuntha' and no adjective like kārya is added there.
>>
>> In the Rangaramanuja Kathopanishad bhashya we see:
>>
>>
>> 4. कठोपनिषत् - प्रथमा वल्ली
>> - मम उपदेशात्, जानीहि इत्यर्थः । ज्ञानस्य फलं दर्शयति - स्वर्ग्यमग्निं
>> इति । अनन्तस्य - विष्णोः लोकः, तत्प्राप्तिम् । *तद्विष्णोः परमं पदम्' *(क.उ.३-९)
>> इति उत्तरत्र वक्ष्यमाणत्वात् । अथो - तत्प्राप्यनन्तरं प्रतिष्ठाम् - *अपुनरावृत्तिं
>> *च; 'लभते' इति शेषः ।
>>
>> The above says: tad vishnoH paramam padam = the mukti from where *there
>> is no return.* In the Narada Purana verses cited, we have this alluding
>> to that  *तद्विष्णोः परमं पदम् ।*। २३-८७  from where the people return
>> after experiencing bhoga for long.
>>
>> regards
>> subbu
>>
>>>
>>> Similarly, consider the episode of the Sanakadi Rishis reaching Vaikuntha
>>> and cursing Jaya and Vijaya. Even after this, we see Jaya and Vijaya born
>>> in the material realm. This raises two important points:
>>>
>>>    1.
>>>
>>>    If the Sanat Kumaras had truly reached *Nitya Vaikuntha*, they would
>>> not
>>>    be seen anywhere else, such as in Brahmaloka. But we see that at the
>>>    beginning of Bhagavatham's Mahatmyam only there is Narada and Sanat
>>> kumara
>>>    samvada which is at the beginning of Kali yuga. And the Jaya vijaya
>>>    incident should have happened very before this meeting.
>>>    2.
>>>
>>>    If Vaikuntha were a place of *non-return*, then the curse on Jaya and
>>>    Vijaya could not have led them back into *samsara*.
>>>
>>> Thus in Vishishtadvaita, we clearly differentiate between two realms:
>>> *Karya
>>> Vaikuntha* and *Nitya Vibhuti Vaikuntha*. It is the *Nitya Vibhuti
>>> Vaikuntha* that is the true eternal, non-returnable abode, not the Karya
>>> Vaikuntha. For instance, in the *Uttara Kanda* of the Ramayana, when Lord
>>> Rama takes all the people of Ayodhya to His *Dham*, this refers to *Karya
>>> Vaikuntha*, not Nitya Vaikuntha. As per the siddhanta, the mukti can be
>>> obtained either by Bhakthi yogam or Sharanagati.
>>>
>>> This understanding is supported by *Arthapatti Pramana.*
>>>
>>>
>>> Regards
>>> Sangeerth P
>>> 8608658009
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>