[Advaita-l] Binary nature of Jnana

[H S Chandramouli]

Namaste Venkat Ji,

Concerning VS.

Reg  <<  the text essentially holds that mahAvAkya jnAnam intrinsically
gives rise to aparoksha jnAna. That is what the snippet below also says
- ata eva mahAvAkyenAvyavahitapratyagbrahmAparokShaj~nAnameva  jAyate, na
tu parokShamiti

Because of certain obstacles present in the student, even after hearing the
mahAvAkya he feels that he is still an ajnAni. Therefore the sAdhana for
him is to keep repeating shravaNAdi until he gets the conviction that he is
Brahman.

 The text does not stipulate that the mahAvAkya must be heard once again
after the obstacles are removed. Nor does it say that the mahAvAkya should
not be heard again.

This is where a possible inference can be made - In certain cases, the
student may require the guru to speak the mahAvAkya once again. In other
cases, the student may not, a recollection of the previously heard
mahAvAkya may be enough  >>,

First para, my understanding of the text quoted is that mahAvAkya shravaNa
*invariably* gives rise to aparOksha jnAna.

In the second para above, my understanding is that **shravaNAdi ** in this
context in VS does not include mahAvAkya shravaNa.

In the third para, since aparOksha jnAna has already arisen, the question
of hearing the mahAvAkya again does not arise at all for such a sAdhaka.
That is what VS upholds when it refutes alternate views. Repitition of
mahAvAkya is required in respect of ONLY those sAdhakAs in whom no jnAna
arises at all, parOksha or aparOksha, on hearing the mahAvAkya first time.
As per VS, if at all jnAna arises on hearing the mahAvAkya, it is
invariably aparOksha jnAna.

The alternatives suggested in fourth para do not arise at all as explained
above.

This is my understanding.

Concerning Bhashya,

Reg  << The bhAShya portion you had quoted did not make this explicit
requirement, but I may have missed it >>,

I presume you are referring to repitition of mahAvAkya, and not to
repetition of shravaNa itself. Bhaskar Ji also has referred to the same. I
am responding based on this assumption.

The following portion from BUB 1-4-7 may be referred. It clearly mentions
that  hearing of the mahAvAkya ONLY  during shravaNa leads to Realization.
It applies to the repeated shravaNa also.

BUB  1-4-7  << …From न, अर्थान्तराभावात् ।…………..Upto न ;
आत्मवादिवाक्यश्रवणेनात्मविज्ञानस्य जनितत्वात् — किं भोः कृतस्य करणम् ।  >>

<< …..(From)  na, arthAntarAbhAvAt |…………. (Upto)  na ;
AtmavAdivAkyashravaNenAtmavij~nAnasya janitatvAt — kiM bhoH kRRitasya
karaNam | >>.



Upadesha sAhasri,  Metric,  Chapter 18

<<  अशनायादिनिर्मुक्त्यै  तत्काला  जायते  प्रमा I

तत्वमस्यादिवाक्ार्थे  त्रिषु  कालेऽप्यसंशयः II >>  Verse  103

<<  ashanAyAdinirmuktyai  tatkAlA  jAyate  pramA I

tatvamasyAdivAkArthe  triShu  kAle.apyasaMshayaH II  >>,

<<  प्रतिबन्धविहीनत्वात्स्वयं  चानुभवात्मनः  I

जायेतैव  प्रमा  तत्र  स्वात्मन्येव  न  संशयः  II  >>   Verse  104

<<  pratibandhavihInatvAtsvayaM  chAnubhavAtmanaH  I

 jAyetaiva  pramA  tatra  svAtmanyeva  na  saMshayaH  II  >>,

It is clearly brought out here that Realization is coterminous with hearing
of the mahAvAkya. Hence hearing of the mahAvAkya again during the
repetitious shravaNa is essential for Realization.
Regards

On Wed, Jul 13, 2022 at 9:05 AM Bhaskar YR <bhaskar.yr at hitachienergy.com>
wrote:

> praNAms Sri Chandramouli prabhuji / Sri Venkatraghavan prabhuji
>
> Hare Krishna
>
>
>
> I think this is where you differ - I believe, based on the below (pasting
> what you had said earlier), you are saying that the mahAvAkya has to be
> once again physically heard:
>
> "SMN have to be practiced together over and over till Realization which
> takes place only during Shravana, on the utterance of the MahAvAkya
> (forming part of Shravana) by the Guru *after* Manana and NididhyAsana
> help in refining the mind to enable such Realization to take place, even
> though the sAdhaka  might have  heard the MahAvAkya from the Guru earlier."
>
> The bhAShya portion you had quoted did not make this explicit requirement,
> but I may have missed it.
>
>
>
>    - Yes for this quote only I was asking for the bhAshya support.
>    AvruttyadhikaraNa and bhAshya do not speak anything in specific with regard
>    to this.  But Sri ChandramouLi prabhuji assured me that there could be a
>    specific support for this elsewhere in prasthAna traya bhAshya.  I heard
>    that if the sincere mumukshu take sannyasa from his guru, after taking
>    sannyasa, to this sanyasi shishya alongwith praNavOpadesha, Guru would give
>    mahAvAkya upadesha also and ask him to do dhyAna on that!!??  I think this
>    practice (if at all it is so) in tradition would support that after SMN
>    once again mahAvAkya shravaNa required for the dhyAna to get jnAna.  Any
>    authentic information on this would be highly appreciated.
>
>
>
> Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!
>
> bhaskar
>