[Advaita-l] akdhandaakara vRitti - My mistake

Venkatraghavan S agnimile at gmail.com
Mon Jul 6 03:29:22 CDT 2015

Sri SadAji,
What attributes do attributes have? What is the attribute of blueness
itself? The answer has to be nothing - but still it is possible to perceive
blueness. So it is possible to perceive an attributeless thing.

If not, how can one cognise Brahman, an attributeless thing?

On 6 Jul 2015 09:06, "kuntimaddi sadananda via Advaita-l" <
advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:

> Rameshji - PraNAms
> That was my first post -Here we are referring to jnaana phalam although
> there is no phalavyaapti for the Vedanta jnaanam.  I was told that I was
> wrong. I waited to get clarification from Swami Paramarthanadaji. In
> response to my question of what is akhandaakaara vRtti he mentioned (or to
> be more precise I heard) the Vedanta jnaana vRitti that eliminates the
> jiiva-brahma abhinnatvam and makes us understand the ekatvam. It is not
> phalam but the jnaana vRitti that eliminates the bhinnatvam of
> jiiva-brahma. I was told that I am wrong again. I am not sure if I am wrong
> or the definition is incomplete as it is claimed that it applies to
> perception of objects too.
> It can apply in the case of soyam devadattaH since we have two operations-
> 1. Direct perception of the current devadatta where the current attributes
> of Devadatta are involved, and 2. recollection of past perception from
> memory where that devadatta with different attributes are involved. Hence
> in the knowledge of soyam devadattaH, this is that Devadatta, the
> attributes of this and that Devadatta are to be discarded since they are
> contradictory, and only take the essence of Devadatta -The process is
> bhaagatyaga lakshana where part of it rejected  and part is retained;  the
> contradictory vishshaNaas are rejected and unifying one is filtered since
> there is only one Devadatta.
> Note that in the first perceived Devadatta, we do not perceive him devoid
> of attributes but with current attributes. When we recall, we recall the
> past Devadatta with past attributes. Now we use Viveka that sees
> cognitively the changeless Devadatta in the changing devadattas. Hence it
> is not direct perceptual knowledge, but can only be known by those who have
> the Viveka (who can pick up the changeless ones in the changing ones).
> Hence the example is used to understand tat tvam asi -using baadhyaayam
> samanaadhikaranam or discard the contradictory qualifications while
> retaining the essence.  Only a trained mind can do that.
> We also note that in the direct perception, the knowledge is always
> attributive knowledge since senses can only gather attributes.  In the
> recollection (internal perceptions) we do not have sense input, but still
> in recollecting a cow or horse we do recollect the viseshnana sahita
> viseshya , the object with attributes the recollection of cow differs from
> that of horse.
> When we see for the first time since we have no memory of the past, then
> the cognized object is stored with a  name . Second time perception
> involves direct perception that cause cognition and recollection from
> memory past similar attributive object and matching (sometime if the
> recollection is vague or fuzzy) the attributive content, we say,  this is a
> cow or He is Devadatta, etc. Vishishtaadvaita says the first time cognition
> is indeterminate and the second time on the cognition is determinate.
> The point remains however that only without the attributive content the
> object cannot be cognized – In seeing we see form of an object. But in
> hearing we have to go by the attributive sound to compare whether it is a
> cat or dog that is not seen but heard. In the case of lightning we see
> first then we hear later since we have learned that velocity of the light
> is greater than sound – even though both happened at the same time. All
> these aspects are involved in perception shabda, sparsa, ruupa, rasa and
> gandha- where sometime direct contact with the object with sparsa and rasa
> is involved for cognition and recognition.
> Hence I maintain  based on our experiences, that there cannot be
> perception of an object without visheshanas since by definition one object
> differs from the others because of visheshanas only.  I cannot say I have
> indeterminate perception of cat, cow and horse here – it is like blank
> perception without the attributive content. If theoretically it is
> formulated then it has no relevance to human experience.
> Therefore I am not sure what akhadaakaara vRitti in perception of unitary
> objects is.
> Hari Om!
> Sadananda
>  Sunday, 5 July 2015 9:49 PM, Ravi Kiran <ravikiranm108 at gmail.com>
>  wrote:
>  On Sun, Jul
>  5, 2015 at 7:51 PM, Keshava PRASAD Halemane via Advaita-l
>  <advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
>  wrote:
>  namastE. praNaams
>  My Dear
>   श्रीमल्ललितालालितः
>  I am continuing further on the same line of
>  thinking . . .
>  Irrespective of the object
>  being objectified, the akhanDAkAra-vrtti  always
>  corresponds to the brahmAkAra-akhanDa-vRtti
>  This would
>  mean..
>  akhanDAkAra-vrtti is
>  of the svayam-prakAsaka Brahma vastu alone, hence get Its
>  brahmAkAratva
>  since
>  akhanDAkAra-vrtti on any object does not dispel the ajnAna
>  of Brahman
>  which illumines the real
>  brahma-vastu in any/every/all object(s); that is the vision
>  of a brahma-jnAni - even when looking at any object the
>  brahma-jnAni sees the brahma-vastu in any/every/all objects
>  being objectified.
>  Here it is
>  understood that, because of the brahma-jnAna alone, one sees
>  the real Brahma vastu everywhere ( sarvAtma bhAva) and not
>  because of akhanDAkAra-vrtti on that object, uncovered the
>  real brahma-vastu, dispelling the ajnAna of Brahman
>  So, my understanding about the
>  akhanDAkAra-vRtti is that it goes far beyond any/every/all
>  viShEShaNas and reaches the real brahma-vastu any illumines
>  it, rather than stopping short at the level of the
>  viShEShaNas as in the case of other
>  anEka-AkAra-vRttis.
>  Keshava PRASAD
>  HalemanemOkShakaamaarthadharmahjanmanaa jaayatE jantuḥ |
>   samskaaraat hi bhavEt dvijaḥ ||  vEda-paaThaat bhavEt
>  vipra |  brahma jnaanaat hi braahmaNah ||
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