[Advaita-l] [advaitin] Seeking clarification on Bri. Up. Mantra 1-4-2
kuntimaddisada at yahoo.com
Mon Apr 21 16:09:11 CDT 2014
Subhanuji - PraNAms
First my sincere thanks for taking time to address the issue I had raised.
I have no problem in understanding of the praarabda of a jnaani as long as the BMI which is the product of praarabda remains and the BMI will go through its praarabda, although jnaani has understood that he is not the BMI. There is no problem in that.
The question I had posed was in relation to Shankara bhaasya, in relation 1-4-2 mantra, as translated by Swami Madhavanandaji. In the discussion of the mantra 1-4-2, an objection was raised by a presumed purvapakshi.
In the bhaashhya it says -That his fear was removed by the knowledge of unity; was quite proper.
Implication of the statement was the Viraj was jnaani in the previous life itself before he took the birth as Viraj since he was not taught after he was born as Viraj, and whatever knowledge he had was from his previous birth.
Hence it is not the praarabda of Viraj that is being discussed. If he has taken the birth of Viraj even after jnaanam in the last birth, then we have a problem. Jnaani can be reborn but due to his sanchita/aagaami karma only, which should have got destroyed with the jnaanam in his past life.
Hence the objection was raised in the Shankara bhaashhya itself and the objection was valid. My only comment was that I failed to see in the siddhanta that followed the purvapaksha addresses the central objection that was raised, unless I missed something in that since the explanation is very exhaustive and somewhat round about. If you can clarify the sidhanta that followed the objection and how it address the objection, that is great.
Since jnaani need not have to take birth other than as avataara, I reconciled the situation as Viraj in his previous life had only partial knowledge – of tvam padartham and not aham brahmaasmi – realization. Then Viraj can have praarabda since he was not a jnaani and he needs the teaching of Vedanta. Hence I mentioned about Hamsa Geeta in the Bhagavatam that addresses his problem. Viraj only knew that He was alone and there is no other being to be afraid of.
If your feel Shankara’s sidhaanta following the objection addresses the issue or if you feel that vaartika addresses the objection posed in a different way please let me know.
The issue may not be important but from the point of overall teaching, just curious in terms of how purva paksha was handled.
On Mon, 4/21/14, subhanu <subhanu at hotmail.com> wrote:
Subject: [Advaita-l] [advaitin] Seeking clarification on Bri. Up. Mantra 1-4-2
To: "Advaita-l List email" <advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
Date: Monday, April 21, 2014, 2:30 PM
Sri Sadananda wrote "Anyway since the
issue remains unless I take it that he has no full knowledge
of the abosolute, I will stop with this".
Namaste to all
Though it has mostly been covered, I thought I would add a
few points to Sri Sadananda’s query re BUB 1.4.2:
Sri Chandramouli has correctly given BUBV
1.4.103 as the response to the query. When discussing the
prārabdha of a jñāni
one would find it useful to keep the maxim from tattvabodha
top of mind: prārabdha-karmaṇām
In BUBV 1.4.57 Suresvara states that the main
purpose is just an illustration (pratipatti) to show that
only true knowledge
of Brahman brings true fulfilment [ityetat pratipattyartham
kutsanam]. As such, the question of why or how Viraj became
a jñānῑ should not
be brought into this discussion.
In this context the seeming presence (note the
word seeming-see below), of prārabdha is tied to their
remaining duties to be
exhausted. These are carried out out of compassion and for
the benefit of
mankind. In commenting on BUBV 1.4.103, Anandagiri explains
that the great
rishi’s such as Vasishtha and Vamadeva, though
jnānῑ’s, continued until their
duties to mankind were fulfilled:
api svādhikāra samāptir paryantam. As such they may then
be seen to go throught
the emotions of anger, fear etc though this is not really
the case.The footnote
makes it even clearer: “yāvadadhikāram avasthitir
jagatah paripālane niyuktānām
adhikārasamāptir paryantam avasthitih abhyupagantavyā
(this last word is
important-it qualifies that this is how we should take it
for the purpose of
Swami Vidyaranya brihadāranyaka vārtikāsāra
1.4.62-66 provides the above in a little more detail. I can
provide you the
full verses if you like , but I will just quote
“virājo’dhikritih sriṣṭau vyāsādeh
For completeness I mention that the Sanskrit
commentary on brihadāranyaka vārtikāsāra, the
laghusangraha, states when
commenting on the above verse “adhikārah prāabdham
karma”- the seeming prārabdha
of the jñānῑ is interwoven with their duties to the
For those wishing to understand Suresvara’s position on
Jivanmukta you can consult BUBV 1.4.1528-1557 where this is
detail. One should always remember that the discussion of
jivanmukta and the
karma etc of the jñānῑ is adhyāropa from the ignorant
(cf Talks with Sri Ramana Maharshi 383 “In fact his karma
is seen only from the
ajnānῑ’s standpoint”. The apavāda by Suresvara
appears later in BUBV also.
I hope the above is useful. Sri Sadananda, I would always
recommend that, whenever one is studying, or wishes to teach
a passage of the
BUB or TUB, then it is indispensable to present the
vārtikā verses alongside
the bhashyam. Should you at any time require such references
then please feel
free to reach out privately to me and I will do my best to
To unsubscribe or change your options:
For assistance, contact:
listmaster at advaita-vedanta.org
More information about the Advaita-l mailing list