[Advaita-l] Can Jivan Mukta become bound again a if he offends Ishwara?
rajaramvenk at gmail.com
rajaramvenk at gmail.com
Mon Jun 17 07:33:21 CDT 2013
Hare Krishna. I don't know the exact reference numbers of the purana - will let you know once I find it.
However, as bandha and moksha are true only in vyavahara, logically are they not under the control of Ishwara? The traces of avidyA that remains in a jnAni is under the control of Ishwara. The results of prarabda is delivered by Ishwara and the jnAni is aware of it. Is it not?
Let us say hypothetical case of a jnAni, due to purva karma vasana, acts as in BhG 16.18, resorting to ego, power, arrogance, desire and anger hating Him and others, will he get the result stated in 16.19 of getting thrown in to wombs of demons in nether worlds?
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From: V Subrahmanian <v.subrahmanian at gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2013 15:50:58
To: <rajaramvenk at gmail.com>; A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta<advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] Can Jivan Mukta become bound again a if he offends Ishwara?
On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 12:25 PM, <rajaramvenk at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hare Krishna. What is the sastra (shruti) pramana that a jIvan muktA will
> not become bound again whatever he does after self-realisation due to
> prarabda and purva karma vasana? I found the following smrti verse, which
> says that a jivan mukta will become bound by karma if he offends the lord!
> jévanmuktä api punar bandhanaù yänti karmabhiùyady acintya-mahä-çaktau
> The jévanmuktas again become bound by karma if they commit offense to
> theLord, possessor of inconceivably great energies
Could you pl. give the source of the verse, if possible?
In the BhagavadgitA and the bhashyam we have:
य एवं वेत्ति पुरुषं प्रकृतिं च गुणैःसह।
सर्वथा वर्तमानोऽपि न स भूयोऽभिजायते।।13.24।।
13.24 He who knows thus the Person and Nature along with the qualities will
not be born again, in whatever way he may live.
यः एवं यथोक्तप्रकारेण (1) वेत्ति पुरुषं साक्षात् अहमिति (2) प्रकृतिं च
यथोक्ताम् अविद्यालक्षणां गुणैः स्वविकारैः सह निवर्तिताम् *अभावम् आपादितां
विद्यया*, *सर्वथा सर्वप्रकारेण वर्तमानोऽपि सः भूयः पुनः पतिते अस्मिन्
विद्वच्छरीरे देहान्तराय न अभिजायते न उत्पद्यते, देहान्तरं न गृह्णाति*इत्यर्थः।
//13.24 Sah yah, he who; vetti, knows, in the manner described; the purusam,
Person, that Self possessed of the characteristics stated above, as 'I
(am That)'; and knows prakrtim, Nature as described above, which is
characterized as ignorance; to have been eradicated by Knowledge, saha,
with; gunaih, the qualities which are its modifications; na abhijayate,
be born; bhuyah, again-after the fall of this body of the man of
does not become born again for (taking) another body, i.e. he does not take
another body; sarvatha api, in whatever way; vartamanah, he may live. From
word api it is understood that, it goes without saying that one who is firm
his own duty is not reborn.//
Anandagiri, the sub commentator, says: 'whatever way means by indulging in
prescribed and prohibited acts.' Madhusudana says: '...whatever way = owing
prArabdhakarma like Indra, by transgressing the rules.'
Dhanapati Suri, another sub commentator for Shankara says: '...by
Says Swami Vidyaranya in the Panchadashi, 2nd chapter:
102. When the intellect disregards the notions of duality, it becomes
firmly established in the conception of non-duality. The man who is firmly
rooted in the conviction of non-duality is called a Jivanmukta (liberated
103. Sri Krishna says in the Gita: `This is called having one's being in
Brahman, O Partha. None, attaining to this, becomes deluded. Being
established therein, even at the last moment, a man attains to oneness with
104. `At the last moment' means the moment at which the mutual
identification of the illusory duality and the one secondless reality is
annihilated by differentiating them from each other; nothing else.
105. In common parlance the expression `at the last moment' may mean `at
the last moment of life'. Even at that time, the illusion that is gone does
106. A realised soul is not affected by delusion and it is the same whether
he dies healthy or in illness, sitting in meditation or rolling on the
ground, conscious or unconscious.
107. The knowledge of the Veda acquired (during the waking condition) is
daily forgotten during dream and deep sleep states, but it returns on the
morrow. Similar is the case with the knowledge (of Brahman) � it is never
108. The knowledge of Brahman, based on the evidence of the Vedas, is not
destroyed unless proved invalid by some stronger evidence; but in fact
there is no stronger evidence than the Vedas.
109. Therefore the knowledge of the non-dual Reality (thus) established by
the Vedanta is not falsified even at the last moment (whatever
interpretation be taken). So the discrimination of the elements (from the
non-dual Reality) surely ensures peace abiding or bliss ineffable.
In the Jivanmukti viveka too Vidyaranya deals with the idea of a possible
delusion that a jivanmukta can be exposed to, which is over and above the
Vedanta siddhanta taught in the Panchadashi above:
the JMV,� VAsanAkshaya prakaraNa,� as quoted in the 'Yoga Enlightenment and
// Objection: If attachment and aversion are admitted in a knower of the
Truth ('Jnani' as per the original), then, on account of the resulting
merit and demerit, there would arise the contingency of his being reborn
after death.� Reply: Such is not the case.� Likes and dislikes that are
akin to uncooked seeds (capable of sprouting) and foreshadowed by avidya
(and, so, by the erroneous identification of the Atman with the mind) are
the ones that, by virtue of their constituting the primary variety of
attachment and aversion, cause rebirth.� The attachment and the like of the
Knowers of the Truth are, however, like burnt seeds (which are incapable of
sprouting) and merely have the appearance of the primary ones. //
Now, here is a case where there is a clear admission of the possibility of
raga, dvesha, etc. appearing in a Jnani.� Is it not a case of being
affected by prArabdha?� After all, prArabdha is of the nature that comes
from natural forces, the bodily ailments, other people, animals and the
like.� They touch the body-mind of the person.� When thus touched, they
arouse reactions in the form of raga, dvesha. In the above excerpt the JMV
is talking of a Jnani in whom this reaction comes about.
What follows is another excerpt from the JMV itself, subsequent to the one
that is stated above:
// (Though they be mere appearances of the primary likes and dislikes of
the ignorant and incapable of contributing to rebirth) t*he likes and
dislikes of the Jnani would, while they last, cause trouble like the
primary likes and dislikes.* A false snake seen in the place of a rope
causes, for the time being, fear just like a real snake.� The case of the
apparent likes and dislikes (of a Jnani) is like this.�
Objection: There would be no trouble at all (even temporarily) if the
falsity of the apparent likes and dislikes were kept in mind.
Answer:� May you live long! This (keeping in mind the falsity) is what we
regard as marking jivanmukti.//
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