[Advaita-l] The Four kinds of 'Mukti' compared with the 'Kaivalya' of Vedanta

Bhaskar YR bhaskar.yr at in.abb.com
Mon Jun 21 06:20:30 CDT 2010

praNAms Sri Subbu prabhuji
Hare Krishna

> 23. The Gita teaches that all loka-s upto and including Brahmaloka are
>    temporary.  VishNuloka and Shiva loka are no exceptions.
> >  Which verse/chapter in geeta talks about these loka-s & their 
> nature?? kindly let me know.
> आब्रह्मभुवनाल्लोकाः 
पुनरावर्तिनोऽर्जुन ।
मामुपेत्य तु कौन्तेय पुनर्जन्म न 
विद्यते  ॥ 8.16

In this shloka it is said that all loka-s upto and including Brahmaloka 
subject to transmigration: return to earth.  The Bhashyam says: a 
is a loka where beings, bhUta-s reside/exist.

>  just I was curious to know shiva lOka & visNulOka in geeta hence was my 

Brihadaranyaka Up. 4.4.6 which teaches the Jnani's subtle body does not 
leave the physical body at all upon death.

The sUkshma shareera of the Jnani, upon death of the sthUla shareera, 
dissolves 'here itself', that is, it merges in
the pancha bhUtas, their kAraNam.  In (Advaita) Vedanta, the sUkshma 
shareera is also a kaarya of pancha bhuta, (sattva guNa samaShTi of the 
pancha bhUta-s).  It is not that the sukshma shareera does not want to 
the physical body, it is implication of the subtle body too merging in the 
pancha bhuta-s.

>  again, please tell me what exactly the death of sthUla shareera here?? 
without disassociation of sUkshma shareera from the stUla shareera can we 
perceive the 'death' of sthUla shareera??  For example there is an 
explanation of death in bruhadAraNyaka 4.4.1 & 2 & prashNa & sUtra bhAshya 
fourth adhyAya..But these references donot mention anything about stUla 
shareera's continued association with sUkshma shareera upon death.  OTOH, 
it is said that karmendriya-s (like vAgindriya ) will be merged in manas & 
chakshurAdi jnAnedriya-s too alongwith their tejOrUpa will be merged in 
mana with the complete disassociation from the sthUla shareera. and this 
mana will enter into the region of hrudaya and after getting the vrutti 
for the next janma it would merge in prANa..So, IMO, disassociation of 
subtle body from gross body is quite clear during the death 
procedure...Kindly let me know which maNtra in bruhadAraNyaka says us 
jnAni's subtle body does not leave the physical body 'at all' upon death.

These distinctions are not based on fullness or partness of Jnana; it is 
only based on the strength of the antahkaraNa.  All these 'types' have the 
SAME brahmajnana; there is absolutely no difference in that. 

>  It is good prabhuji, so you are telling the jnAna in brahmavida, 
vareeya, varishTa is ONE and the same and there is absolutely no 
difference in THAT jnAna. 

But, their antahkaraNa paripaaka is bound to differ just like all jnanis 
do not weigh the same, they do not have the same complexion. 

>  this is bit confusing, here you are implying that there is a 
possibility that even before getting paripUrNa paripakvate in antaHkaraNa 
the SAME brahma jnAna can be realized by the jnAni-s who have different 
level of antaHkaraNa paripakvate!!?? and you are also implying here 
aparichiina Atma jnAna would 'fit' differently in different compartments 
of antaHkaraNa in jnAni-s!! Are you sure this is what your stand is?? 

The sthUla deha taaratamya is definitely there in the sukshma deha too. 
This cannot be denied or
wished away.  This is what forms the basis for the above 'classification'.

>  In that case those who have difference paripakvate of antaHkaraNa do 
have different level of jnAna & it cannot be same in that case. A 75 
percent paripakva antaHkarana cannot hold/ have saMpUrNa (cent percent) 
Atma jnAna..Kindly let me know, which is the yardstick we are using here 
to say despite having different level of paripakvate in antahkaraNa they 
are having ONE & SAME jnAna?? 

From the above two bhashyam passages it becomes cleqar that: There is a
mind, mental state, that is affected, that is, a vikAra takes place, anger
arises, when beaten or scolded.

There is another mind, another mental state, where even the vikAra does 
arise, no anger arises, when beaten or scolded.  Both these states are in
daivee sampat.

>  These verses are about two category of people who have daivi sampat & 
asuri sampat not different levels of jnAni-s..if you say 'suppression' is 
also jnAni lakshaNa, then this jnAni is definitely 'entertaining' duality 
but due to unavoidable circumstances he is 'suppressing' his emotions..I 
can openly say I am also one of this type of jnAni-s:-))I would suppress 
my anger, agony when my boss fires me left and right :-)) I would suppress 
my emotional outburst when my wife unnecessarily makes a big issue out of 
nothing at home :-)) Deliberate suppression indicates identity with 
indriya-s & shOka mOha...he cannot be a jnAni at all at least as per 
shruti siddhAnta.  AnandaM brahmaNo vidvAn a bibheti kutaschana..says 
taitireeya..if he suppresses his bheeti than that suppressed bheeti in one 
way or the other would definitely come out in one way or the other...This 
is applicable to all kAma krodhAdi arishadvarga-s...OTOH, shruti crying at 
its top voice for the jnAni : tatra kO mOhaH kaH shOkaH ekatvaM 

Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!

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