[Advaita-l] mithyA from archives

prem d p prem_d_p at yahoo.co.in
Sun Dec 16 09:53:22 CST 2007

  dear sri ramesh,
  In one of your own earlier posts you had given a brilliant description
  of how the manifoldness of the World is due to the arbitrary
  boundaries that the observer draws. There-in lies the clarification
  that you seek, as you, no doubt, considered that the boundaries
  are superimposed on a sea of homogeneity called Existence.
  Ourself as the subject-witness forms the substratum for all our
  experience. This is readily grasped by our intellect. On enquiring
  further about the witness, we, thro' the process of neti neti soon 
  arrive at witness-consciousness which transcends the limitations of
  the space-time framework. In fact the space-time itself transforms 
  into a transcendental substratum of pure existence. Pure Existence
  aspect of the substratum is posited here from a pure objective
  perspective of the Witness. (Pure Existence has a significance only
  to the Pure Intelligence holding it. Tat Tvam Asi is realized here
  itself, but let us carry on some more!) Post-Relativity science also
  tells us that space-time exists only in the context of objects
  (matter-energy) and is co-extant with the field. Thus Witness has no
  specifics, no location or boundaries in space-time.
  Let us now concentrate on the Object (say, our fundamental particle).
  Objects manifest by way of 'definition by delimitation'. Obviously such
  a delimitation is possible only on a substratum. This is the essence of 
  the Object. Thus we have arrived at the object-substratum which is an
  essential homogeneity, first recognized as space-time. On further
  enquiry, this space-time itself yields a transcendental unknowable
  This 'unknowability' is the key to ultimate realization. Logically, the
  only unknowable is the Seer. Seer or Atma cannot be seen or known
  as He is the one who sees or knows. Hence the Unknowable may be
  understood to be equivalent to Self or Seer. Also as stated in my
  previous post, the two Unknowables are also non-dual by virtue of
  non-difference. The interior unknowable essence of the fundamental
  indivisible particle is nothing but its substratum, and as such, is the 
  substratum of  all objects. We may say, all Knowables are nama-rupa,
  and all Unknowables are the Self.
  Upasana is a practical way to realize this identity or appropriation of
  the Other by the Self.

Ramesh Krishnamurthy <rkmurthy at gmail.com> wrote:
  Dear Sri Prem,

Apologies for the delayed response on this one. Have been tied up with
a few things of late.

On 30/11/2007, prem d p 
> i found the problem of fundamental particle vs. advaita
> as very intellectually stimulating. i think the problem
> is a litmus test of our understanding of advaita!

Sri Amuthan's responses seemed to indicate that my question was
somehow ill-formed. Perhaps it was but I still haven't clearly
understood why, though I did appreciate some of the points he made. I
am glad that you attempted a different response.

> the problem pointed out by sri ramesh is, i believe,
> that the fundamental particle not being a 'sanghata'
> can exist for itself. thus we have our self and its self,
> apparently compromising advaita.

Indeed, that is what I was indicating.

> but the interior of the postulated fundamental particle
> ie. the 'thing in itself' or noumenon, by virtue of being
> non-differentiable from the Self, sruti declares
> tat tvam asi. thus according to sruti the Self of the
> observer is non-different from the 'essence' of the object.

I couldn't understand the above. Rather, it appears to me that one
cannot make any claim regarding the relationship between the self of
the observer and the essence of the object. From your statement above,
we can never say whether the two are identical or different.

Anyway, thanks a lot for your response. I am quite sure this issue has
a solution within the framework of Advaita-Vedanta, but it requires
more study on my part.

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