doubt on the role of shruti vAkyAs ( was Re: [Advaita-l] advaita and vedas)

m w all_discussions at
Thu May 11 11:10:47 CDT 2006

Amuthanji, you said it right, but again there is something more to it, little bit more, maybe a little play of words....
          There is no way to liberation! In fact when all the concepts related to bondage or liberation die down, then whatever is IS. Libeartion is a word that is the opposite of bondage but in truth both these words are again words and nothing more. Once transcendence comes, these words have no value. You can always find all this in most of the scriptures, for they are saying it right. 
          I won't say that I haven't taken my time in understanding the things. We search for something, all the time we try to keep looking for it and think that it will come in this way or that way, when all that is happening in the mind. The day we stop the running, there it is always...the so called liberation or whatever you call it. Janaka is mentioned in Bhagvada Gita as a jivanmukta, but I am pretty sure that how he was a jivanmukta is still where we miss the point. The day one establishes in this  understanding of how Janaka was a jivanmukta, know that you are already liberated. This thinking of not being liberated is another hurdle that has to be overcome. 
          All of us know that the libearation and bondage is of the mind (see "the parables of Ramakrishna") and once the mind is seen as non existant then there is liberation there and then. There are many scriptures which don't project liberation in any future. For them liberation is there and then, only we have to work for it as you said Amuthanji for chitta shuddhi. Still that is also not the goal that can be achieved in distant future, it is also considered to be achievable there and then. It is our own insistence thinking that we are in bondage that we stay in bondage. 
        When you talk about direct experience then that also is not contigent upon any conditions. It again comes to transcending all that you are holding on to. As Karthikji's post to which I sent a reply yesterday, nothing can stay there, all has to be transcended, and understanding of it is enough. You don't have to throw away your normal garbs, don't have to do anything out of the way. 
  Sahaja SamAdhi is the best for it is based on simple realization, no out of the way and out of the world things need to be done. The whole Bhagvada Gita talks from the first page to the last-- Arjuna fight. Where did Arjuna go, nowhere, he did what he was supposed to do, wherever his situations had lead him. That we don't see and always try to bend Bhagvada Gita according to our own interpretations, for it is so with BG. It is very flexible. You make the path and the water of BG will start moving in that direction. Rest is upon our natures, where they lead us. 
            Also Amuthanji, it is just a discussion. I am not arguing for anything for whatever you said was perfectly fine, and I hope you take it in that spirit. 

Amuthan <aparyap at> wrote:
  namo nArAyaNAya!

dear shrI manIsh,

--- m w wrote:
> I think Amuthanji, there are so many paths, as
> there are different natures of seekers.

there are innumerable ways to gain chitta shuddhi. but
there is only one way to gain liberation and that is
through aparokSha tattva j~nAna. of course, chitta
shuddhi is a necessary prerequisite for this aparokSha
tattva j~nAna to arise.

vAsudevaH sarvaM,

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