[Advaita-l] compare and contrast

Ramesh Badisa badisa55 at hotmail.com
Wed May 12 10:05:52 CDT 2004

Dear respectable members,

>You say that jIvanmukti is not salvation in the absolute sense and then
>contradict yourself saying that salvation is for the soul and not the body.

Badisa: There is no contradiction please. According to you, if jeevan mukta 
state itself is salvation in absolute sense, then what is the fate of karma 
yogis, if annihilated their karma to zero and if they die before divine 
experience? More over, it is the soul, not the physical body, that follows 
the 8/24 devyan path of Gita (as well as sruti) to reach the Brahma Lok. At 
the end of pralaya, these souls will get absolute salvation, as mentioned in 
Brahma Sutra, 4.3.10.

>How is this reconcilable? If salvation is connected only with the soul, how
>does it matter whether the body is present or not?

Badisa: Even though absolute salvation is concerned to the soul, in order to 
remove the layers of ignorance (due to accumulation of karmas), the soul 
requires human body. This way, the ignorance can be removed by spiritual 
sadhana. Without a physical body, it is not possible to do spiritual 
sadhana. Therefore, this human body needs to be utilized for divine 
realization apart from doing our work.

Salvation is the realisation of unity of the Self and Brahman. When this 
realisation has
>dawned, there is nothing else to achieve. The presence or absence of a body
>is immaterial.

Badisa: You did not give any sruti reference for your explanation. Then, 
what will happen to the divine experienced soul after the physical body dies 
here? Please give sruti references.

The soul of jIvanmukta doesnt merge with anything upon the
>death of the physical body. The *merging*, *becoming* etc. are all just
>figurative speech.

Badisa: Sir! who has to say it? On the other hand, if these are your 
personal opinions, then they are respectable. If not, then,  I request you 
to quote sruti references in your next posting.

>Hari Om
In Summary:

Badisa: Absolute salvation is concerned only with soul. In order to reach to 
that state, the ignorance and bondage etc need to be removed on the part of 
soul, and if not removed then the soul is caught in samsar, life after life, 
meaning that the soul will take upadhi every time. A human body is required 
to practise spiritual sadhana. That is the reason our experienced spiritual 
masters always emphasize that when we are blessed with this human body, it 
needs to be utilized for divine realization apart from doing our work. 
Absolute salvation is resulted by the spiritual sadhana done by the live 
physical body. Thus, when the prarabdha karma is zero for a jeevan mukta, 
this physical body falls down here on the earth, while this soul will merge 
in divine, called absolute salvation (sadhyo mukti). The state of a jeevan 
mukta is not an absolute salvation, even though he has experienced the 
divine. See, he is still facing his prarabdha karma, and because of which he 
has some delay to achieve absolute salvation. Thus, we have in sruti, "for 
him there is some delay as long as he is not delivered from the physical 
body"(Chh. Up. 6.14.2). This delay is for getting absolute. Why this delay 
for a jeevan mukta? Because, he is still facing the prarabdha 
karma.Therefore, a physical body is required to annihilate the karma, and to 
experience the divine.

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