Reality of the world

K. Sadananda sada at ANVIL.NRL.NAVY.MIL
Thu Aug 16 12:27:45 CDT 2001

Jaldhar - thanks for the info.

>It's a subject I still need to learn more about myself.  By idealism I
>mean the idea that apparently perceived objects are only essentially
>mental constructs.  The problem is if the perceived universe is all in the
>mind, it is a rather strange coincidence that for example a couple of
>hundred widely dispersed people of different kinds and walks of life
>should all be hallucinating advaita-l at the same time!

But is it not in the mind of the observer who is observing the
presence of the other people too. If they do not exist independent of
the observer, how can one prove that.  All the apparent objects get
folded when the observers mind goes to deep sleep.  I do not see this
as a problem from my analysis.

>  Anandagiri
>mentions this in the context of Shankaracharyas criticism of the
>Vijnanavada Buddhists.  Nand referred to this too.  Realism on the other
>hand refers to the idea that objects exist independently of a perceiver.

The last one is extremely difficult to prove.  I would love to hear
the proof for that.

>If we accept what I call the idealistic view, my statement is pointless.
>However if we accept the realistic view, mithyatva becomes a more complex
>thing with multiple levels.

That is precisely the point.  Here is where one runs into problem in
countering the objections from other schools.  I do not see the need
for this, as existence of the world cannot be proved without the
perceiver and therefore  perception process has to be understood.
VishhishhTadvaita and dvaita resort to 'anubhava' or experience to
show that the world is real.  But experience involves experiencing by
the mind.  We are back to the analysis of the mental process. As I
see it there is no way to avoid the perceiving mind.

>  > Fundamentally "thing out there" cannot be established independent of
>>  the mind
>I guess this is what I'm still having doubts on.  I'll look for statements
>in the shastras concerning this.

Sure Let me know if you succeed.

Hari OM!
K. Sadananda
Code 6323
Naval Research Laboratory
Washington D.C. 20375
Voice (202)767-2117

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