mmsudan at BOL.NET.IN
Fri May 14 20:06:07 CDT 1999
nanda chandran <vpcnk at HOTMAIL.COM>
>>From your posting it appeared to me that you placed more importance on
>service to the society than Self-realization.
very right. the more I think and more I am getting convinced to it. That
Religious order i.e Maths, temples,organisations etc. the religious peoples,
class are either not involved or less concerned on certain
aspects of our Physical, Social and Moral life which is going to be, at the
end of the day,
Let us have of look. what type of physical, Social and Moral life existed
Think of the age of Lord Rama. The life was simple and honest. The earth, the
air, the water, the fire, the Akash is pure. we find threat to religious
life. the Rishi & Munis living in forests are troubled by Raksasas. Lord Rama
is fighting Raksasas to establish order to have peaceful religious and social
The Age of Krishna. there are no Raksasas. The earth, the air, the water, the
fire, the Akash is pureThe enemies are emerging from within one's own self.
Duryoodhana represents that class. what to talk of five villages he is not
prepared to give a needle head of land to Pandavas. We have Lord Krishna
clearly giving a message and there is Dharmayudha to establish order to
have peaceful religious and social life. But still there is problem on moral
aspects. Look at
what Maharishi Vyas, at the end of Mahabharata, says in few words Known as
"Bharatasavitri" I quote " with raised hand, I cry aloud, nobody hears me. By
Dharma not only Moksha is achieved, It
is from Dharma that Artha and Kama arise. Why Dharma is not followed? "
The Present age. The enemies within self are supreme and ruling the
society.The Social and moral life is in shatters. Every thing is being
Money. The relationships are guided by money. The corruption is at the
supreme. The honest and moral man feels suffocated. Even if you try it is
difficult to live hundred percent honest living.
when I sit down to have Pranayama. The mother earth on which I sit is
polluted. The food I eat is produced with chemicals or genetically
engineered. The Air which I breath is polluted. The water I drink is
polluted. The Akash, there are holes in sky the Ozone layer is
depleted. the fire, of course it can not be polluted, But fire is misused.
There are Nuclear Bombs etc.
What is happening at religious level? what our modern Rishi, Munis doing?
There is degradation in this order. We not only have Chandraswami at top,
down the line upto street level society is full of small Chandraswamies.There
in Tulsi Ramayan that in Kaliyug what type of sanyasin we will have. " the
wife is dead, wealth is lost, shave your head and be a sanyasi" Each
Temple, Ashram or Math is only interested in collection of money whatever its
colour, white or black. Just tell me how many religious persons are there who
will loudly refuse to accept as Dana(Donation) any money earned through
illegal means. I am yet to see even one religious organisation which is not
troubled by the clash of egos and infight of persons at helms of affair,
(which we here term as playing politics). The ruffians in the streets are the
custodians of moral order extracting money in the name of organising
functions like Bhagwati Jagarns etc. I am only listing few examples the list
may be endless. The whole religious order itself seems to be in disorder.
This change has not happened in one day or year. It is happening over the
centuries and what will be the shape of few centuries ahead one can imagine.
Who is to take the lead to set whole thing right?
Is it the job of government, social and voluntary organisation,
individuals or the religious order has some role to play? What is my supreme
What is the supreme Dharma of the religious order? Moksha first or
Mother Earth,Social and Moral order first? I am in search of answers.
It is in the above context I initiated the discussion by using word "
Practical Vedanta" I have been
benefited by the various view. In absolute strict interpretation/sense 'Rama'
may be right but 'Sunder'
has also put it practically to mean practice Vedanta. 'Anand' has beautifully
'put the nail
on the head' by saying Let us follow sAmAnya-dharma or
sAdhAraNa-dharma . But what is the sAmAnya Dharama of today?Do we or Don't we
interpret ancient texts to find new idioms suitable to to Present Physical,
Social and Moral environment?
>From shambho at geocities.com Sat May 15 11:36:01 1999
Message-Id: <SAT.15.MAY.1999.113601.0500.SHAMBHO at GEOCITIES.COM>
Date: Sat, 15 May 1999 11:36:01 -0500
Reply-To: Vaidya Sundaram <shambho at geocities.com>
To: List for advaita vedanta as taught by Shri Shankara
<ADVAITA-L at LISTS.ADVAITA-VEDANTA.ORG>
From: Vaidya Sundaram <shambho at GEOCITIES.COM>
Subject: Re: Practical Vedanta
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
----- Original Message -----
From: mmsudan <mmsudan at BOL.NET.IN>
> >>From your posting it appeared to me that you placed more importance on
> >service to the society than Self-realization.
> very right. the more I think and more I am getting convinced to it. That
> Let us have of look. what type of physical, Social and Moral life existed
> through the
> in Tulsi Ramayan that in Kaliyug what type of sanyasin we will have. " the
> wife is dead, wealth is lost, shave your head and be a sanyasi" Each
> Who is to take the lead to set whole thing right?
Please do not by any stretch of imagination think that vedanta and the
people who are in the pursuit of vedanta are irresponsible, non-caring and
self centered human beigns; for some reason, that is the impression i am
getting from your mails. If I am wrong, please accept my apologies also, I
just wanted to clarify some things here.
For one, your statements comparing our present times with Treta yuga and
Dwapara yuga are fatally flawed in that the dharmic levels of the people are
different in each yuga and are lowest in this kali yuga. what else do you
expect but what you have decsribed?
Secondly, we (people in the study of vedanta) spend a lot of time in the
world we see around us. The fraction of time we spend with ourselves is
pitiably small. The way I see the world around me affects who I am, since
all of them drag my mind away. To be centered in the self (or trying to be)
is not the same as self centered - as you seem to imply. Please find the
time to read pages 487-491 of Talks with Ramana Maharishi. His answers are
an unfailing guide in this matter. I do not want to quote verbatim all over
again, it is up tp you to take it or leave it.
Who is pained in the world? You? or the people who exist in your perception
of the world? If you have a head ache and hence see the world has a pink
tinge to it, but you "know" that it should be in all colours etc etc ... do
you take the medicine or give the medicine to the rest of the world? See the
analogy? You have a problem with the world. The world probably has a problem
also. Solve yours first. That is all that is asked.
Please understand that the reason some of us dont feel as strongly about
"reforming" the world as you do, is not because we are complacent. We are
all full of enthu and all that, but some of us place greater emphasis on the
teachings of jnAni's like Ramana Maharishi and others, who literally beseech
us to find our "Selves" and hence try as much as we can to find it.
bhava shankara desikame sharaNam
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