Gummuluru Murthy gmurthy at MORGAN.UCS.MUN.CA
Thu May 21 06:43:04 CDT 1998

On Wed, 20 May 1998, sadananda wrote:

> [...]
> Thus there are three degrees of understandings.
> In the pure nirguna state - I alone am - there is nothing other than me.
> In the Saguna state - I am iswara - mayaadhyakshena prakRiti suuyate
> sacharaacharm - Under my adhyaksha or presidency everything is projected,
> the movable and immovable - This prakRiti is my maaya - mayantu prakRitim
> vidyaat -  and I am the wielder of this maaya.
> In the jeeva state - I identify with the individual body, mind, intellect
> as I am them.
> The second and third,  Iswara and Jeeva are interconnected since it is the
> Jeeva's notion that there is a creation and there is a creator, iswara, who
> can even comedown and teach us B.G. and there is a shastra as a pramaana
> etc., etc.

Namaste. Please correct me if I am wrong in the following:

I see only two states.

The jeeva state, or the state of ignorance, and

The nirguNa state, the state of jnAna.

The jeeva state includes the saguNa state mentioned above. In the state of
ignorance, jeeva sees creation, and with jeeva incapable of creation,
invokes Ishwara, the creator. But jeeva can never be the creator, and
hence, can the saguNa state have the status of a state ? However, it is
an important sub-state which allows us (i) to see the limitations of the
jeeva, and (ii) to surrrender the ego with humility to a superior power.

In that way, I take bhagavad-gita, not as a narration by Lord Krishna
(Ishwara) to his disciple Arjuna, but as a discussion that goes on within
any individual between the consciousness (Krishna) and the ego (Arjuna).
I realize I am opening Pandora's box with this, but is that thinking
invalid ?

> Hari Om!
> Sadananda

Gummuluru Murthy
Yadaa sarve pramucyante kaamaa ye'sya hr^di shritaah
atha martyo'mr^to bhavatyatra brahma samashnute   Katha Upanishhad II.3.14

When all the desires that dwell in the heart fall away, then the mortal
becomes immortal, and attains Brahman even here.

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