[Advaita-l] Debunking Drishti-Srishti Vada and Eka Jiva Vada - part 1
Praveen R. Bhat
bhatpraveen at gmail.com
Wed Jul 19 11:18:15 EDT 2017
On Wed, Jul 19, 2017 at 2:40 PM, H S Chandramouli <hschandramouli at gmail.com>
> Reg << any tarka that lets one remain with the aikyajnAna as shown by
>> Shruti is valid >>,
>> But the whole problem is to “remain with the aikyajnAna as shown by
>> Shruti “. How to achieve it is the question.
> True, but you are talking of a later stage of SDV. In DSV, there are not
many stages. Its just one tarka that resolves all question and then one
just stays with that knowledge.
It is very well within our knowledge that any understanding based on tarka
>> lasts only till another tarka which is more powerful is met with.
> True, but only in SDV, where Shruti uses karaNa-kArya sambandha,
satya-mithyA sambandha, etc, for one to go from kArya to kAraNa. There are
many questions to be resolved there, since there are too many views of too
many philosophers. In DSV, any question thrown is answered as svapnavat,
since the sAdhaka has no doubt of mithyAtvam of jagat. The details as to
how that is becomes irrelevant.
> It is not that any other tarka is not needed after the first
>> understanding, the alternate tarka just comesup.
> Not for a DSV follower, for everything there is this convincing
brahmAstra of logic: svapnavat.
> Then there is samshaya as to which one is correct.
>> That leads to further tarka, all of which lands the sAdhaka back into SDP
>> Yes, but only to those whom svapnavat is not convincing as I mentioned
in the previous mail; they are not followers of DSV.
> The understanding will be lasting only on स्वानुभवमात्र् (svAnubhavamAtr)
>> ( intuitive experience alone). The JMV of Swami Vidyaranya considers two
>> types of sAdhakAs who have reached the stage of first understanding through
>> श्रवण (shravaNa) namely योगि (yogi) and परमहम्ससन्यासि
>> (paramahamsasanyAsi). Considering their competence in different types of
>> sAdhanAs, the परमहम्ससन्यासि (paramahamsasanyAsi) continues the sAdhana
>> in the vichAra mArga to achieve स्वानुभव (svAnubhava), while the योगि
>> (yogi) continues in the upAsana mArga. It is at this stage that DSP is
>> ideally suited for the योगि (yogi).
> svAnubhava is needed in both. Paramahamsa sannyasi is one who gets the
same being an uttamottamAdhikAri at shravaNa itself. Mandukya Karika
Bhashya specifically mentions this in advaitaprakaraNa that such sAdhakas
do not need any futher sAdhana since all stages of jnAna are attained
immediately. Those who don't get it on shravaNa need to other stages with
effort, where Karikakara and Bhashyakara use words such as "manaH
nirudhyate", "nirvRttiH", "samAdhAna/ samAdhiH", all hinting to yoga. I was
planning to write this up as a separate thread sometime, but haven't gotten
to it yet.
He is extremely
>> suitable f
>> or upAsanAs. The DSP is practically the same or approximates to
>> निर्गुणब्रह्म उपासन (nirguNabrahma upAsana).
> DSV is not necessarily nirguNabrahmopAsana, since the former is with
knowledge of oneness and the latter is since one doesn't understand oneness
as talked about in Panchadashi 9th chapter! The main difference is that one
resolves any doubt that show up due to vAsanAs by the only logic that DSV
stands on, but in nirguNabrahmopAsana, it is Shruti says so, aham
brahmAsmi. That said, just as in SDV, nididhyAsana and upAsana are
possible, so too in DSV.
> Thus two alternate approaches are recognized at this stage, vichAra and
>> We can now consider the status of a ज्ञानि (j~nAni). I am just copying a
>> verse from Swami Vidyaranya in his commentary on कौषीतकि उप(kauShItaki
>> upa.) in his अनुभूतिप्रकाश (anubhUtiprakAsha). Verse 67, Chapter 8,
>> book page 763 (book referred to in my earlier post).
>> << दृष्टिसृष्टिमिमां ब्रम्हानुभवी बहु मन्यते। स्वप्रबोधात् स्वसंसारो
>> लीयते स्वप्नवद् यतः । >>
> Not a good translation, please bear with me. Better still, correct it
>> <<The one who has already experienced Brahman gives great importance to
>> this Drishti-Srishti Prakriya because just like the dream ends when one
>> wakes up from the dream, so also our samsAra (jagat) sublates on
>> Enlightenment >>
The translation looks okay to me, but here's my try:
यतः स्वप्रबोधात् स्वसंसारः स्वप्नवत् लीयते, [ततः]
इमां दृष्टिसृष्टिं बहु मन्यते।
Since one's bondage disappears like a dream on rise of knowledge of the
self, [therefore] the enlightened considers this DSV great.
In closing, I agree with most of what you said, except that there instead
of saying there is no tarka at all in DSV, I would say that there is only
one tarka needed. And I wouldn't call DSV as upAsana, since upAsana is the
term technically used when there is no jnAna of oneness, which is possible
in both cases of SDV and DSV.
--Praveen R. Bhat
/* येनेदं सर्वं विजानाति, तं केन विजानीयात्। Through what should one know
That owing to which all this is known! [Br.Up. 4.5.15] */
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