[Advaita-l] 'world' is not the mental creation of tiny soul !!
kuntimaddisada at yahoo.com
Wed Mar 26 21:42:53 CDT 2014
Dear Sada ji,
In the BSB 3.5.17 itself Shankara cites the mahAbhArata/viShNupurANam verse: In the Mahabharata itself the Lord Himself denies reality to those forms and that they should not be taken to be His nature/guNa and kriyA:
माया ह्येषा मया सृष्टा यन्मां पश्यसि नारद ।
सर्वभूतगुणैर्युक्तं नैवं मांज्ञातुमर्हसि ||
After showing His vishvarUpa darshana to Narada, the Lord says: Narada, what you see Me here is My illusory projection. Do not know Me as endowed with all these attributes. Also, the Br.upanishad 'indro mAyAbhiH pururUpa Iyate..' bhAShya says that Brahman takes various forms owing to avidyA cognitions.
So, there is no way one can show that the shruti-based creation method contradicts the pauruSheya quotes.
Subbuji – PraNAms
Here are some considerations to ponder.
Let me put your last statement this way. Yes, shruti based creation method is not contradicted by smRities, even though each smRiti has its own version of creation – supposed to be some 80 plus theories of creation in puranas. I am sure you agree that one has to interpret the pourusheya statements in tune with the shruti statements.
What I have mentioned is local mind cannot create and then cognize and then say that it is illusion. That is not Vedanta. Global mind, yes- which we call Iswara.
The above sloka you quoted is in tune with my statement. I know that you know that the rope/snake adhyaasa being praatibhaasika involves prior knowledge of snake in some form, not created by the local mind. The creation in the waking state is not praatibhaasika error but vyaavahaarika adhyaasa. Transactions at karmendriya level goes just beyond cognition where I need not run away from perceived snake but can capture it and put it in basket, if I am skilful. Similarly a dreamer can capture the tiger that is chasing him in his dream. These are vyaavahaarika satyams.
Hence- sa kaale satyavat bhaati PRABHODE satyasat bhavet – says Shankara – applicable to both dream creation and creation in the waking world. The key word is prabhode - All the slokas that you quoted can be correctly interpreted from the perspective of jnaani than ajnaani where one shifts to aatama-anaatma reference.
As you know the Advaita makaranda sloka you mentioned –… jagat gandharva pattanam -comes as the third sloka – after establishing that aham brahmaasmi in the first two slokas and even in that sloka it says – sarvajnam sarvakaaraNam – that does not pertain to the local mind.
My point is one has to obviously interpret smRiti slokas in consistent with Vedanta. I am sure you agree with that. The point is only to come up what is the correct interpretation that is in tune with Vedanta.
This is my understanding : As long as one is in the triad format – jiiva-jagat-Iswara- which involves I am a jiiva notion with the local BMI as I am, the creation is not by that local mind and after creating perceive with the mind that it has mind created all the attributive world that it perceives using again its senses and then cognize it as if it is there outside that local BMI.
Even for praatibhaasika one uses the attributive content of the snake or ghost from the memory that is projected on the object. atasmin tat buddhiH involves (a) the object that is there that mind did not create, (b) the projection of attributes of another object from the memory based on (c) the prior perception of the object that the mind did not create before.
I am sure you agree that there is clear distinction between vyaavahaarika satyam and praatibhaasika satyam.
The reference shifts, however, with the knowledge where one is now identifying with totality where the system now reduces to aatma-anaatma vichaara. All the slokas you have quoted from poursheyam can also be interpreted from that perspective without contradicting the Shruti statements.
I must say that so far my understanding has not been negated – that the creation is not by the local mind but by the global mind, where local mind only cognizes as well as transacts with what is created by the global mind. This transactions can continue even after jaanam. As I mentioned, local mind can create on top of what is created by global mind due to its raaga dweshaas which we call as jiiva shRiShTi in contrast to Iswara shRiShTi as vidyaranaya discusses in 4th Chapter of Pancadashi. Jiiva sRiShTi is the cause for samsaara and not Iswara sRiShTi. The difference is very important from jnaanam point, which I know that you know.
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