[Advaita-l] 'world' is not the mental creation of tiny soul !!
bhaskar.yr at in.abb.com
Mon Mar 17 05:01:14 CDT 2014
sAshtAnga praNAms Sri VidyA prabhuji
I am really happy to note that Sri Vidya prabhuji, my guruji, who has
gracefully initiated the advaita vAsana in me, showing interest in my
ramblings and asking me some questions. Prabhuji, kindly pardon me if
what your student of vedAnta saying below is not matching with the
traditional stand of advaita.
But, consider this. When you see pots and jugs as clay, do you see clay
or do you also see clay in the form of pot, clay in the form of jug, etc?
> prabhuji, mere looking at the pot as pot, jug as jug is not avidyA but
seeing the pot, jug etc. as independent one from 'clay' is avidyA. So,
when the jnAni sees the jagat he sees the jagat as brahman only and not
jagat as jagat independent of brahman. prior to jnAna what has been seen
as asarvaM, asatyaM etc. after the dawn of knowledge it becomes / realized
as sarvaM satyam and there exists nothing but HIM. And this is what has
been said as Atmaikatva drushti / samyak drushti.
If the latter, then you are lending some measure of reality to the vikAra,
what is only vAcArambhaNa nAmadheya.
> I dont think so prabhuji. vAchAraMbhaNa nAmadheya in kArya rUpa
(vikAra) would help us to know the sAmAnya in those vikAra. We are not
attributing any sort of reality to the vikAra since our intention is to
realize the kAraNa behind this kArya vikAra. That is the reason why,
shaunaka asks : kasminnu bhagavO vijnAte sarvamidaM vijnAtaM bhavati? If
we know the kAraNa svarUpa (lOha, mruttike etc.) of kArya, the kArya has
been realized in its kAraNa svarUpa. Example : If I know the cow-ness
(gOtva / kAraNa) of the vikAra of nAma-rUpa of various cows, that
vAchAraMbhaNa nAmadheya hardly disturbs me as a reality. And this kArya
is there for us to know that behind all these vikAra there is ONLY ONE
sAmAnya. vAchAraMbhaNAm, vAgAlambanaM, vAgArambhaNaM ityetat. These are
all nAmadheya-s mere nomenclature, there to teach us the kAraNa. And
through this nomenclature only we can be able to realize that brahman is
all this and at the same time nirupAdhika as well clarifies shankara in
bruhadAraNyaka : yadi hi nAmarUpe na vyAkreeyate tadA asyAtmanO
nirupAdhikaM rUpaM prajnAnaghanAkhyaM na pratikhyAyeta. Though these nAma
rUpa on its own not at all satya, these nAma rUpa-s are satya only in its
kAraNa svarUpa...mruttiketyeva satyaM, vAchAraMbhaNaM vikArO nAmadheyaM.
In other words, is it possible to have a perception of jugs and pots
after the real nature as clay is known?
> jnAni's jnAna is not any avasthAteeta or restricted to one particular
state or vyavahAra abhAva jnAna prabhuji.
Yet, just like in the rope-snake analogy, ignorance of the real nature of
(as avikArI) is what gives rise to the jagat perception, full of vikAra,
in the first
place. kasyeyam avidyA?
> but jagat is NOT like snake on rOpe this is what shankara clarifies in
chAndOgya (6.2.3) : To the question: asadeva tarhi sarvaM yadgruhyate
rajjuriva sarpAdyAkAreNa?? shankara answers: NA !! sata eva
dvaitabhedena anyathAgruhyamANAtvAt na asatyaM kasyachit kvachit iti
bhrUmaH. Subsequent clarification in the same bhAshya by shankara would
help us to know that jagat as an independent one is asat but jagat as in
its kAraNa rUpa satyameva.
If you say that the jnAnI sees the avikArI brahman even when s/he sees the
jagat that is full of vikAra, you will eventually devolve to the
vAsanA or saMskAra mode of explanation.
> bAhyAkArabhedabuddhinivruttireva AtmasvarUpAvalambanakAraNaM says
bhagavatpAda in geeta bhAshya. prabhuji you only clarified guNA guNeshu
vartante etc. here jnAni does not do anything since he is neither kartru
nor bhOktru. sarvAtma bhAvO mOkshO vidyAphalaM kriyAkAraka phala
shUnyaM...yatra avidyAdi kArma karmaNi na santi clarifies shankara in
bruhad bhAshya. It would be better if we understand advaita jnAna is all
about : bAhyAkAra bedha buddhi nivrutti and it is NOT bAhyAkAra
nivrutti...jnApakaM hi shAstraM na tu kArakaM...jnAna does not annihilate
anything, jnAni only reveals the truth behind what is there already
If you say that the jnAnI does not see the vikAra of jagat at all, and
brahman, niravayava, nirviSesha, nirguNa, nirvikAra, then you will veer to
jnAna happens in nirvikalpa samAdhi mode of explanation.
> prabhuji kindly see above.
Neither of these is acceptable to the paksha that insists that avidyA is
subjective, pertaining to the jIva only, not brahman, and is purely an
> Kindly pardon me prabhuji. I am not able to understand this clearly
with the purported intention of your goodself. Do you mean to say here
avidyA pertains to brahman and not to jeeva??
sAshtAnga praNAms once again prabhuji,
Your humble servant
Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!
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