[Advaita-l] Samit Pani, do we really have to stretch this ??

[Nithin Sridhar]

Dear Sujal ji,

If Prarabda is not present, why would in Brahmasutra 4.1.13 it is
said-"When Knowledge is attained, there is destruction and nullification of
past and future Karmas".?

If Prarabda is not remaining, then a person who attains Jnana becomes
Videha-Mukta immediately. But, we see that so many Jivan-Muktas are present
for the welfare of the world. When a person attaining Jnana has
extinguished all Prarabda Karma( that were responsible for his present
body), then he would become "Videha Mukta" immediately. On the other hand,
if  a Jnani remains in the world as Jivan-Mukta, its because the Prarabda
Karmas responsible for the body is yet to completely extinguished.

But, I am not saying that Prarabda creates limitations in a Jnani. Instead
I am saying, that the body is maintained due to the Prarabda (Even
Ramakrishna is saying so in the above quote).

For a Jnani, all Avidya has been indeed destroyed, but the momentum caused
due to Avidya remains a little even after its destruction. This as I
understand, is variously called as Avidya Lesha or Prarabda. Because,
without that, then a Jnani living in his body is not possible. This was
what Ramakrishna meant by "Retaining connection with body/Ego etc"

I feel I am not at all contradicting you when you say, Jnani has no
limitations. Jnani is without Karma. That is what I have written in my
piece.

"The action by its very nature is due to Ignorance. An activity assumes a
subject, object and the action. But, a Jnani who has realized Brahman as
being beyond all activity, beyond all mutability, eternal, birth-less etc
How can such a Jnani perceive Birth, death and such mutations? How can such
person perceive the duality subject and object? How will such a person be
subjected to or bounded by Karma?"
http://nithinsridhar.wordpress.com/2013/10/29/random-musings-part-17-the-state-of-jnana/


-Nithin S






On Tue, Oct 29, 2013 at 5:39 PM, Sujal Upadhyay <sujal.u at gmail.com> wrote:

> >
> > These days, instead of 'samit', an android phone with a working internet
> > connectivity to a 'realised guru' who can guide one through the maze of
> > 'samsara' aided by the 'sastra' and grace of god should do the work! Not
> > forgetting to carry suitable gifts & prostrate with humility
> > -'shiShyaste.aha.n shAdhi mA.n tvA.n prapannam'
> > Regards
> > Balagopal
> > PS: even this forum is helping mumukshus in keep going forward.
>
>
> Maybe Upanishad would mean - to stay connected to Guru via internet ;)​​
>
>
> OM
>
> Sujal Upadhyay
>
> "To disconnect from the self and to become Aware of anything else is
> nothing but unhappiness" - Bhagawan Ramana Maharshi
>
> He who has faith has all
> He who lacks faith, lacks all
> It is the faith int he name of lord that works wonders
> FAITH IS LIFE, DOUBT IS DEATH - Sri Ramakrishna
>
>
> On Tue, Oct 29, 2013 at 4:43 PM, balagopal ramakrishnan <
> rbalpal at yahoo.co.in
> > wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > >>>"samit" is the upa-lakSaNa as mentioned in vedantasara.
> >
> > These days, instead of 'samit', an android phone with a working internet
> > connectivity to a 'realised guru' who can guide one through the maze of
> > 'samsara' aided by the 'sastra' and grace of god should do the work! Not
> > forgetting to carry suitable gifts & prostrate with humility
> > -'shiShyaste.aha.n shAdhi mA.n tvA.n prapannam'
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > Balagopal
> > PS: even this forum is helping mumukshus in keep going forward.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Tuesday, 29 October 2013 2:52 PM, Sujal Upadhyay <sujal.u at gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> > Namaste,
> >
> > @ Nithin ji,
> >
> > Prarabhdha is negated by BG 4
> >
> > *Adhyaropa*
> >
> > न हि कश्चित्क्षणमपि जातु तिष्ठत्यकर्मकृत्।
> > कार्यते ह्यवशः कर्म सर्वः प्रकृतिजैर्गुणैः।।3.5।।
> >
> > 3.5 Because, no one ever remains even for a moment without doing work.
> For
> > all are made to work under compulsion by the gunas born of Nature.
> >
> > *ApavAda*
> >
> > यथैधांसि समिद्धोऽग्निर्भस्मसात्कुरुतेऽर्जुन।
> > ज्ञानाग्निः सर्वकर्माणि भस्मसात्कुरुते तथा।।4.37।।
> >
> > 4.37 Just as burning fire turns fuel to ashes, O Arjuna, so does the fire
> > of knowledge turn all Karma to ashes.
> >
> > The explanation for Prarabhdha is only for the those who cannot believe
> > when they see Jnani undergoing suffering or getting sick, etc. Else how
> can
> > one attain Jnana if there is anything left in mind.
> >
> > Here in BG, Bhagavan says all karmas, which includes Prarabhdha too.
> >
> > Sri Ramakrishna says that just to retain the connection with body, a
> Jnani
> > shows some interest in or attachment to object like having interest in a
> > particular type of food, etc. If one stay in Nirvikalp samadhi for 21
> days,
> > then body, like dry leaf, would drop off. Some like Sukhdev ji retained
> ego
> > of knowledge. This ego is pseudo and is like a burnt rope or like a sword
> > which is touched by philosopher's stone (parasmani). Technically it is
> God
> > who is working or expressing himself through the body of Jnani.
> Everything
> > happens spontaneously. Life is a happening.
> >
> > Jivan Mukta Gita and Atma Vidya Vilas would be helpful.
> >
> > If anything remains in mind, then mind is not destroyed. Hence everything
> > empties. Even Prarabhdha is burned by fire of knowledge.
> >
> > OM
> >
> > Sujal
> >
> > OM
> >
> > Sujal Upadhyay
> >
> > "To disconnect from the self and to become Aware of anything else is
> > nothing but unhappiness" - Bhagawan Ramana Maharshi
> >
> > He who has faith has all
> > He who lacks faith, lacks all
> > It is the faith int he name of lord that works wonders
> > FAITH IS LIFE, DOUBT IS DEATH - Sri Ramakrishna
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Oct 29, 2013 at 2:26 PM, Nithin Sridhar <
> sridhar.nithin at gmail.com
> > >wrote:
> >
> > > When it is said that Jnani has no Karma, it means that Jnani who
> remains
> > in
> > > Paramartika Dasha, for him no Karma binds. But, a Jivan-Mukta remains
> in
> > > his body till his Prarabda Karma is extinguished. Hence, even many
> > > Householders have become Jnani's. The examples can be that of King
> Janaka
> > > or Rishi Vashista etc. In the recent times the example of Lahari
> Mahasaya
> > > can be given.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> http://nithinsridhar.wordpress.com/2013/10/29/random-musings-part-17-the-state-of-jnana/
> > >
> > > -Nithin
> > >
> > >
> > > On Tue, Oct 29, 2013 at 11:49 AM, Bhaskar YR <bhaskar.yr at in.abb.com>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > praNAms Sri Venkatesh prabhuji
> > > > Hare Krishna
> > > >
> > > > Just my few additional thoughts :
> > > >
> > > > In Advaita Parampara we can see Rishis like Vasishtha, Sakti,
> > Parashara,
> > > > Vyasa and Suka. Those Rishis were householders living with wives and
> > > > children.
> > > >
> > > > > AFAIK, shuka was not a householder, he was a born jnAni, anyway,
> let
> > > > that matter be aside.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > They were doing Yajnas regularly. But they were Brahma Jnanis. No
> > > > one can deny that.
> > > >
> > > > >  jnAna and karma cannot go hand in hand, there is an elaborated
> > > > discussion on this in shankara's geeta bhAshya.  Here shankara gives
> > > > details how the paramArtha jnAni cannot engage himself in karma-s.
> > > >
> > > > In Upanishad period all Brahma Jnanis were householders only. There
> > were
> > > > no
> > > > Sanyasis.
> > > >
> > > > >  I am afraid, this is rather an exaggerated claim.  prabhuji, do
> you
> > > > have any scriptural reference for this statement?? BTW, I am not able
> > to
> > > > understand this upanishad period!! since tradition holds that veda-s
> > are
> > > > anAdi, apaurusheya & its doctrine is not time-bound.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > In Upanishad period the Advaita was followed was different. It was
> like
> > > > Mandana Mishra's Advaita like mixing Jnana and Karma.
> > > >
> > > > >  I dont think so, coz., upanishad itself says na karamaNa
> naprajaya,
> > > > tyAgenaike amrutatvamAnashuH...saNyAsa yOga is well documented in
> > shruti
> > > > itself.
> > > >
> > > >  A Brahma Jijnasu was doing Yajnas and studying Upanishads also at
> the
> > > > same time. It was Jnana
> > > > Karma Samuccaya Vada of Mandana Mishra. Mandana Mishra has praised
> > > Vaidika
> > > > Karmas are important for Brahma Jnana.
> > > >
> > > > >  I think pUrva mImAmsaka-s have described vedAnta (jnAna kAnda) as
> > > > eulogy, arthavAda.
> > > >
> > > > Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!
> > > > bhaskar
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