[Advaita-l] Mechanics of Self-Realization
bhaskar.yr at in.abb.com
Thu Jul 22 06:43:25 CDT 2010
praNAms Sri Sadananda prabhuji
Since your part-I completely deals with ajnAni and his vyavahAra & causes
for this vyavahAra, I dont think there is no need for further deliberation
on image-mirror-original analogy coz. in this ajnAni vyavahAra any analogy
holds good :-))But, our problem starts when you are speaking about the
jnAni in the light of this 'mechanics'. Here is some of the problems I am
facing in your dichotomy of 'self-realization'.
Now we can define who is samsaari jiiva and who is a mukta jiiva (or
jiivan mukta) – the divergence occurs between the two at this time,
because of knowledge or lack of it. Knowledge does not change any of
the above process.
> Knowledge does change the process of cognition...A saMsAri or an ajnAni
sees himself as BMI and the jnAni's realization is that he was/is/will be
ever asamsAri/ashareeri...In short, an ajnAni sees the 'snake' in place of
rope and the jnAni sees the ROPE..Moreover, there is no question of
'process' in jnAni, the process what you have defined in part-I involves
the triputi and this triputi vyavahAra would not be there in the jnAni
coz. the jnAna what he gained would reveal him the fact that he is not
jnAtru or pramAtru so there is no pramANa, prameya or jnAna, jneya
vyavahAra!! Shankara quotes a shlOka in sUtra bhAshya which explains : The
individual self is a cognizer ONLY till the intuition dawns on the Atman
to be sought after, but when He is sought out, the very cognizer himself
will have become that Atman free from the evils of sin and the like. And
in geeta bhAshya shankara says : The final pramANa indeed removes the very
knowership of Atman. So, knowledge does change the process of cognition &
it removes the earlier delusion that he is the cognizer.
ajnaani or samsaari is the one who takes the chidaabhaasa or reflected
consciousness as the REAL I am, since he has no knowledge (which can
be only gained by Vedanta vichaara) that I am is pure, original, the
all-pervading consciousness that has no reflection of any kind
anywhere, whatsoever! Hence he takes chidaabhaasa or image as - I am
this – which involves two parts – I am part coming from the original
(remember face example) and this part coming from the mind that is
reflecting the original. Thus the image chidaabhaasa takes itself as
the original guy – claiming this BMI as mine (mamakaara) as a first
step, and I am the BMI (ahankaara) as the second step.
> Kindly note, you are saying even jnAni too have the 'satyatva buddhi'
in reflecting consciousness with his localized set of indriya-s (to do
vyavahAra or whatever may be the cause!!) but parallelly he also knows
(or mere intellectual understanding) that he is THAT original, all
pervading consciousness!! So, as per this, a jnAni does have ONLY this
additional 'information' that he is 'ultimately' that non-dual, all
pervading consciousness. And, by saying reflecting consciousness thinking
ON ITS own that it_is reflecing consciousness, you are attributing the
separate existence to it apart of medium of reflection & the
original...But shankara is quite categorical in denying this 'separate
existence & clarifies that there is NO 'second' chaitanya apart from THAT
and without upAdhi-s there is no 'jeeva' as such.
Then jnaani is the one who distinguishes the two part aspects of this
(unitary) chidaabhaasa ( I am part and this part), differentiates the
two using intellect (viveka) and discarding I am not this part (neti,
neti) but I am is the reflected light of consciousness – reflection of
the original light of consciousness that is all pervading ever shining
pure sat chit ananda swaruupam.
> I beg you to give me the shankara bhAshya reference atleast for the
above statement!! Where shankara says jnAni would realize that he is the
'reflection' of the original light!! Quite contrary to your conclusion,
shankara repeatedly says that jnAni would realize that he is nothing but
THAT, brahmavit brahmaiva bhavati is the shruti.
The BMI – also cannot do this separation process since they are jadam or
> I did not get this, can chidAbhAsa without the aid of BMI on its own do
this analysis or separation process?? What exactly the role of BMI here
in this chidAbhAsa's separation process?? If you mean here chidAbhAsa is a
separate (unitary) entity which does the separation process without
bringing in BMI which is jadam, then it is as good as saying chidAbhAsa is
an 'other' chaitanya, with this advaita hAni & Atmaikatva hAni. And again
please clarify whether this separation process is a mental activity or
not?? if not, then clarify how does this chidAbhAsa would carry out this
Up to this point I have omitted the fact that full jnaanam involves
recognition that I am the substantive of BMI too. Complete knowledge
involves tat and tvam both parts – tat standing of the total universe
along with the creator of the total and tvam involves the saakshii
chaitanyam. This we will discuss next.
> IMO, by omitting this very very important jnAnam, it is really a
blunder to talk anything about jnAni. Hope you would address this issue
Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!
More information about the Advaita-l mailing list