[Advaita-l] Fw: Re: waking, dreaming, sleeping, as mutually supportive

Anbu sivam2 anbesivam2 at gmail.com
Tue Oct 20 03:36:19 CDT 2009

Quote: "Turning the mind inwards does not come easy, which is why we have
all the different karmas and

This is again a statement coming out of affliction from secular ideas of
equality of all men.  Our fold fold varna dharma separates the people on the
basis of their guNa visesham.  Any appeal to the mind is made to the
Brahmanas only for they are the ones destined to leave dehaabimaanam that
starts with the abandonment of karma.  To other varnas such advice to leave
dehaabimaanam is forbidden.  The other three varnas are needed for the
stability, security and well-being of the society by their karmas.

Bhagavan Ramana actually discouraged people from taking to Sanyasa for he
was not in favour of upsetting the dependents of the aspirants.  He advised
them to do what is expected of Sanyasis namely the search for Truth without
relinquishing the present Aashrama.  Such seekers for Sanyasa Aashrama were
invariably from the Brahmin community.  To others (of non-Brahmin varnas)
Bhagavan advised karma and bhakthi maargas.  Women invariably received
manthrOpadesa to quieten their mind.  It is false to say Bhagavan only
taught gnaana maarga.

The famous treatise 'naan yaar' came out of him at the bidding of a
non-Brahmin man.  In spite of this this gentleman came to Bhagavan later and
asked him if he should remarry.  Clearly dehaabimaanam and the consequent
guna-karma vibhaagam was at play.

This great treatise on naan yaar is worth listening to.  It is in Tamil.
Non-Tamil people please excuse.  The English version is also available to
read on the net.


On Mon, Oct 19, 2009 at 9:53 AM, Shyam <shyam_md at yahoo.com> wrote:

> Pranams
> ****
> "I deliberately put "further away" in quotes for the very same reason.
> As made clear in the mANDUkya bhAShya, turIya is the underlying
> reality, not the 4th separate quarter as in the quarters of a coin.
> The issue is that it is near for the sAdhaka with the right 4-fold
> qualifications, the Atman is indeed near. Turning the mind inwards
> does not come easy, which is why we have all the different karmas and
> upAsanas. If I hear once more about how we just have to give up the
> idea of NOT being realized to become realized, I'll barf all over my
> screen.
> Rama"
> ****
> The following is an excerpt from Deivathin Kural, right at the introduction
> - where the Kanchi Mahaperiyava explains this very beautifully.
> "One may wonder: ‘Dispose off the mind – we are ourselves Brahman. That is
> moksha’. This statement of advaita seems to make it all easy for us. All
> along, the other schools are saying that there is something higher than us,
> above our world, that is called a world of moksha; there is a ParamAtmA
> above us, we are only JIvAtmA, far below Him and we have to strive to reach
> His world. But advaita says there is no high, no low; we are ourselves that
> ParamAtmA and in order to reach this moksha we don’t have to ‘go’ anywhere;
> right here we can have that. One may think that this should then be very
> easy. Appears to be easy – but really, difficult
> Because that is a big ‘if’! ‘If only, we can dispose off the mind, ..’,
> then there is the advaita-siddhi. The difficulty is exactly there – to
> dispose off the mind. When our shirt loosely fits us we can take it off
> easily. But if the shirt is tight, the taking off might have to be made with
> some effort. And when we are required to take off our very outer skin,
> imagine how difficult it could be. Just as the skin is sticking to our body,
> our mind is sticking to us, but in deeper proximity! A dirty stinking sticky
> cloth becomes pure when the dirt, stink and stickiness are off the cloth. It
> is not necessary to look for another cloth. The same cloth, when the dirt,
> etc. are off, becomes the pure cloth. So also for our JIva we don’t have to
> look for a new entity called Brahman; if we can remove the present dirt and
> stink of the mind, that should be enough. The same person will emerge as the
> pure Brahman. But that is exactly the formidable task –
>  to remove the dirt and stink that is so deeply adhering to mind! Mind
> refuses to be disposed off. What exactly is this mind? It is the instrument
> which creates thoughts. If the creation of thoughts stops, mind will also
> not be there. But we are not able to stop the creation of thoughts. All the
> time it is galloping to go somewhere. We go through lots
> of experiences and enjoyments. We also keep seeing them; those of this
> birth that we know, and many more in the other births that we do not know.
> Each of them has left an impression in our mind. They keep running in our
> mind and sprout numberless thoughts. It is like the smell that persists in
> the bottle in which we kept spicy asafoetida. So also even after we have
> gone through experiences and enjoyments, their smell persists in our mind.
> This is what is called VAsanA, or JanmAntara VAsanA (VAsanA that comes from
> other births), or SamskAra VAsanA. What does it do? It keeps surfacing
> thoughts about that enjoyment and becomes the cause for further thoughts
> about how to have that experience again. These thoughts are the plans which
> the mind makes. This ‘smell’ of the past has to subside. That is what is
> called ‘VAsanA-kshhayam’ (Death of the VAsanA). And that is the ‘disposal of
> the mind’ ‘Disposal’ implies the ‘end’. What keeps running
>  all the time has an end when it stops running. When a large flow of water
> is dammed, the flow stops. In the same way when the flow of the mind is
> stopped, it means that is the end of the mind. When I say mind is stilled or
> stopped I do not mean the staying or resting of the mind on one object. That
> is something different. Here when I say the mind is stopped or stilled, I
> mean something else. When the mind stays on some one object, it means the
> mind is fully occupied with that object. No other object can have then a
> place in the mind. Even to keep the mind still like that is certainly a
> difficult process. This is actually the penultimate step to ‘dispose off’
> the mind. When a wild animal is jumping and running all around, how do you
> shoot it? It is difficult. But when it is made to stay at one place, we can
> easily shoot it. Similarly the mind that is running in all directions should
> be made to stay at one place in one thought. It does not mean the
>  mind has disappeared then. No, the mind is still there. Only instead of
> dwelling on various things it is now full of one and only one thought. This
> is the prerequisite to what I call the ‘disposal’ of the mind. After this
> the mind has to be vanquished totally. That is when Realisation takes place
> -- Realisation of the Atman. In other words the being as a JIva goes and the
> being as Brahman sprouts. This process of stopping the mind at one single
> thought and then vanquishing even that thought in order to dispose off the
> mind along with its roots is a Himalayan achievement. Our scriptures very
> often refer to “anAdyavidyA-vAsanayA”, meaning “because of vAsanAs of
> ignorance going back to beginningless antiquity”. This is the reason for the
> dirt of the mind being so thick and dense. Removal of that dirt is no doubt
> a most difficult job. However, if we persist with our efforts, by the Grace
> of God, if not in this life, maybe in a later life, that
>  noble of goal of Brahman-realisation, that is, the realisation that we
> ourselves are Brahman and being–in-Brahman happens."
> Hari OM
> Shri Gurubhyoh namah
> Shyam
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