satyan_c at yahoo.com
Tue Jan 31 03:17:10 CST 2006
Amuthan <aparyap at yahoo.co.in> wrote:
Namaste shrI Amuthan,
> *all* experiences also includes deep sleep (suShupti).
> there in no way except by nirvikalpaka samAdhi that
> the truth spoken by the shruti-s can be seen during
An understanding of sleep doesn't require NS. An understanding of sleep just requires one to see that the truth of the sruti statements regarding sleep via analysis in the *sUksma buddhi*.
I slept well is everyones experience. On waking up, the one who says I slept well must have been present in sleep also. One cannot recall another's memory. Hence the continuity of the "I" must have been there in sleep. One has to see that the assertion of the sruti cannot be contradicted by any other pramAna.
If I existed in sleep and I experienced total peace, then it implies that the "I" lacks nothing. This pokes a serious hole in the worldly logic that all of my desires should be fulfilled for me to be happy. This is in fact enough to show that I do not require to fulfil any desires in order to be happy. I do not need any external crutches to be happy. That happiness must be my nature.
avasthatraya viveka in vedAnta doesn't require you to be asleep or in NS when doing sleep analysis because by definition, if you were in either, you couldn't do the analysis since the instrument of analysis is inoperational. One is expected to be in waking state to do that analysis. And what is the locus of that analysis but the buddhi?
BTW, I ignored to respond to you KU Chapter 3.1.13 quote reproduced here:
yacched vAnmanasi prajnah tad yacchejjnAna Atmani |
jnAnam Atmani mahati niyacchet tad yacchecchanta Atmani || KU 1.3.13
"The discriminative one should resolve the speech into the mind. He should resolve that mind into the intellect. He should resolve the intellect into mahat (hiranyagarbha). He should resolve that (mahat) into the tranquil Atma"
There are two kinds of laya: "bhAva poorvaka laya" and "vichAra poorvaka laya". The former requires a physical resolution. The latter requires a resolution by vichAra. This verse doesn't require you to experience the resolution of the mind in the buddhi and the buddhi in mahat using "bhAva poorvaka laya". It requires you to see the truth of that vakya with the "subtle intellect" using kArana kArya vichAra and vyashti samashti vichAra which is generally outside the scope of this discussion. The mind is the cause of speech etc because speech is sustained and directed by the mind. The buddhi is indeed the cause of the mind. The conclusions in the buddhi affect the emotions in the mind. The effects must inhere and resolve in their causes. Hence they resolve in their causes. This is based on vichAra in the *buddhi*.
In fact, if you look at the previous verse:
esa sarveshu bhUteshu, gUdhotma na prakAsate |
drsyate tvagryayA buddhyA sUksmayA suksmadarsibhih || KU 1.1.12
"Being Hidden in all beings, this Atma is not evident. However, it can be seen by the people of subtle vision with a sharp, subtle intellect"
The use of "buddhi" isn't coincidental here.
> and what makes you think that *everyone* 'chasing'
> nirvikalpaka samAdhi 'fancies the truth in only
> certain experiences and misses it in the rest of the
> experiences'??? that is certainly not correct.
> *please* see the other mail where MS clearly shows the
> limitations of a mere attainment of nirvikalpaka
There is no issue if the NS is a byproduct of the knowledge,
in which case it doesn't matter whether there is NS or not,
what primarily matters is that the knowledge is there. If MS talked
about a bramhavit, such a person wouldn't chase NS. Chasing implies
a sense of incompleteness. If he is complete, why would he chase something?
NS may happen, which is fine. NS may not happen, which is also fine. That would be the attitude of someone who sees completeness in all situations.
The knower of bramhan will never chase NS or any experience for that matter. A sishya in advaita vedAnta will also not chase NS because he need not. Why chase something that is neither necessary nor sufficient, especially when he is trying to get established in the knowledge that truth is available in all experiences? He would be contradicting himself by chasing a special experience.
> please elaborate on what you mean by nididhyAsanam.
I could write a little bit here. However, I can direct you to a book that I think will save me some typing because the author has already done good justice. Please see Section 23.
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