hbd at DDIT.ERNET.IN
Tue Jun 18 00:49:12 CDT 2002
Sankaran Kartik Jayanarayanan wrote:
> On Mon, 17 Jun 2002, hbdave wrote:
> > kuntimaddi sadananda wrote:
> > > --- hbdave <hbd at DDIT.ERNET.IN> wrote:
> > > > Stephanie Stean wrote:
> > > >> Can anyone give me some
> > > > references of where this idea is
> > > > > covered more thoroughly?
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks
> > > > > Stephanie
> > > >
> > > > I do not think any one can give you a reference to
> > > > show that Jnana and Bhakti
> > > > are the same.
> > >
> I can :-)
> This quote is from "The Spiritual Teaching of Ramana Maharshi":
> Question: "What is the relation between jnana and bhakti?"
> Sri Ramana: "The eternal, unbroken, natural state of abiding in the Self is
> jnana. To abide in the Self you must love the Self. Since God is verily the
> Self, love of the Self is love of God; and that is Bhakti. Jnana and Bhakti are
> thus one and the same."
> Of course, RM is referring to the highest state as "bhakti", which he
> very often did. You can also read the extract from "Talks" on 22nd March,
> 1939, Talk #650:
Yes, fully agreed. If my initial response is read fully, this is what I tried to
convey. But I understood that the questioner wanted a reference from
scriptures and as far as I know, they are not available directly stating
that Jnana and Bhakti are the same.
Of course, interpretation of Shri Ramana is correct.
> > These can not, in my humble opinion, be taken as valid
> > refernces for equivalence of, say, Jnana and Bhakti, that
> > the original questioner was asking about.
> Bhakti is a process only for those who don't know the real Bhakti. If you
> continue reading "Talks" on the references above, RM's views are clear:
:-) Yes, agreed.
> "You think that bhakti is meditation on the Supreme Being. So long as there is
> vibhakti, bhakti is sought. The process will lead to the ultimate goal as is
> said in Srimad Bhagavad Gita:
> arto jignasush artharthi jnani cha Bharatarshabha
> tesham jnani nityayukta ekabhaktir visishyate
> * Ch. VII (16,17)
> Any kind of meditation is good. But if the sense of separateness is lost and
> the object of meditation or the subject who meditates is alone left behind
> without anything else to know, it is jnana. Jnana is said to be ekabhakti
> (single-minded devotion). The jnani is the finality because he has become the
> Self and there is nothing wrong to do. He is also perfect and so fearless,
> dwitiyat val bhayam bhavati - only the existence of a second gives rise to
> fear. That is mukti. It is also bhakti.
> > Best wishes.
> > -- Himanshu
I again beg to refer to my full initial response. I am very respectfully
aware of teachings of Shri Ramana. The question here was, as I
understood, a reference from scriptures.
The point I was trying to convey is this : though the most trusted and
profound interpretation of Vedas lead to what Vibhutis like Shri
Ramana say (i.e. Jnana and Bhakti are the same), in scripture there
are no direct references to it. We understand this only from the
interpretations by persons of acievement like Acharya,
Shri Ramana or Shri RamaKrishna and many others.
In fact this is the reason that I asked the questioner : "is your query
for academic purposes or for clarifying path of spiritual progress?'"
because in the later case the interpretations are fully acceptable, and
indeed highly beneficial,
but in the former case (depending upon the project supervisor :-( )
such interpretive references may not be adequate.
Best wishes to all.
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